FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
No bio...
User ID: 675
The traditional substitutes are money and power.
...I think you left off a third element, which is "immunity to consequences." There's lots of ways to get money and power. There are few ways to get or wield money and power that are protected from consequences deriving from the getting and the wielding, and almost all those ways involve "be an elite" among them. Include this element, and the hostility toward elites you correctly identify with gains a heaping helping of necessary context. Our elites have almost completely insulated themselves from negative consequences arising from their wielding of money and power, and the resentment this lack of accountability breeds is probably not something the present system can or should survive.
Wild material prosperity is a good start.
Do you believe elites have delivered wild material prosperity? Does the current generation understand that it is living amid wild material prosperity? If not, why not? Was Mangione mistaken? Are his fans in the public and the press and the justice system aware of that fact?
Like, the basic problem with the anti-populist defense of elites is that elites by definition are the people running things, and we can look at the world around us to assess how they're actually performing. So we repeatedly get, as you offer here, vague appeals to how wonderful things are in this best of all possible worlds, which die a death the moment you compare them to the PANIC PANIC PANIC elites themselves observably resort to in order to goad the populace down their preferred policy chute, into their preferred policy captive-bolt-gun.
The public at large believed that "police shooting unarmed black men" was a crisis, because Elites spent a decade intentionally generating the illusion of such a crisis. But the largest spike ever recorded in violent crime was actually real, and was very clearly a direct consequence of the public reaction to that elite-generated illusion.
And so for Education, and the Afghan war, and the GWOT generally, and the criminal justice system generally, and for offshoring manufacturing annd arguably for the economy generally, for the whole of the Trans Rights issue, for the LGBT movement in at least a large part, the COVID response, immigration and on and on and on.
Really, the question is absurd unless you draw a very unintuitive box around “elite human capital.” Purging your best and brightest is not conducive to scientific or cultural wealth.
I can't find the X.com link at the moment to the academic lady with a prestigious fellowship, arguing in an interview that reporting child abuse is racist. So instead, I'll note that I disagree that our present elites are in fact "our best", and that intelligence is very clearly orthogonal to goodness.
We straight-up cannot afford these people. They have to go, and if they do not go peacefully they will absolutely go violently, and much that we value will go with them, and that will still be preferable to the ruin of letting them continue to run things.
Presumably your hedging of 'by its own rules' means something like 'if a member of the outgroup does something bad, we can blame the outgroup for it', and I am sure you have some story of some Trump supporter having a psychotic episode and shooting up a shopping mall getting spun as MAGA violence.
Right-Wing Violence Is Not A Fringe Issue
The American Right and the Thrill of Political Violence
Analysis: What Data Shows About Political Extremist Violence
Right-wing extremist violence is more frequent and more deadly than left-wing violence − what the data shows
The Right's Violence Problem
As Right-Wing Rhetoric Escalates, So Do Threats And Violence
Right-Wing and ‘Radical Islamic’ Terror in the U.S. Are Equally Serious Threats: ADL Report
...Just a couple links grabbed off a stack that rivals Everest.
Blue Tribe wants there to be a legible, coherent category of "Red Tribe violence"; for people to have common knowledge that Red Tribe violence is a live social issue to which current events connect, that there's a history and a dataset, a conversation in progress, potential solutions ready to go.
Blue Tribe wishes to prevent "Blue Tribe violence" from being such a legible, coherent category, or indeed for any of the above features to coalesce around it.
Blue Tribe very clearly uses the dance back and forth between "this is a social problem that demands systemic solutions" and "eh, crazy random happenstance, what can you do" as one of its core political tactics. People recognize this pattern, and they see it everywhere, and charity is burned thereby. This particular front in the Culture War has been operating for much more than a decade. You should be aware of it, and you should, I personally think, account for it in your arguments. Absent such an accounting, your condemnations are meaningless, because it is obvious that they are selectively partisan.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
2d ago
This is the most American of things. Men are free, and when free, this is what significant amounts of them do.
This is certainly a view one can hold. By all means, maintain the same perspective when it is you getting got.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
3d ago
At some point, I want to write a review of that movie, having never actually seen it beyond clips. It seems extremely obvious to me that most of its target audience badly misunderstood it, which is a shame because I think it's an amazing example of explicitly Culture War film. As with Ex Machina, though, it seems like the target audience is willfully determined to miss the point.
Not everything is culture war material.
Do you believe that the personal is not political?
NFL ownership leans Republican.
What sort of Republican? Trump has been fighting a bitter civil war within the Republican party since the 2016 primaries, and that numerous establishment Republicans have explicitly sided with Blue Tribe in opposition to him. "But these people are Republicans" is a line that's been abused for a full decade now. Sure, this person who is voting Democrat and wants me to vote democrat and agrees with the Democrats on all major issues and has nothing for scorn for me is a "republican" because he used to be high-up in the party that took my money and gave me nothing for decades. Obviously he wants to resume that occupation, and obviously democrats would prefer that my choices are to vote for them or for someone who bends the knee every time but who they still get to call names. I have zero incentive to play along with this farce.
"The only thing stronger than hate is love" is a slogan popular among people who take pleasure from publicly contemplating the violent death of my children. I do not believe anyone is actually confused about what is going on here. Some people, even here, simply find it convenient in the moment to pretend.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
8d ago
"Bad Things" and "Subjugation" are subjective terms.
You want humans to cooperate. Cooperation necessitates hierarchy. Hierarchy is not objectively distinguishable from "subjugation".
Even real subjugators generally do not subjugate "for no other reason than that they can". "Put down your feet upon him, that our peace be on the earth" is the typical form.
If you want the able to help the unable, the bare minimum price for that help is for the unable to obey the able. This is not an obscure fact to anyone who interacts with young children. Absent such obedience, you are just obfuscating costs, and the obfuscated costs will bring the system down one way or the other in relatively short order.
Non-law-based norms is the substance from which laws emerge. you can't say "anything not illegal should be permitted", because not permitting things that aren't illegal is how things get to be illegal in the first place.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
8d ago
A liberal's answer - this liberal's answer, for example - would be that, quite the opposite, the personal becomes political because society ie the body politic tries to screw around with people's personal lives.
This framing would make sense if you could define a "personal life" that politics should not screw with. But in fact, no such definition exists, any more than there exists a rigorous definition of "harm" or, in our context, "screwing". The appearance of such definitions is a product of values-coherence, of cultural homogeneity.
In fact, I rather think that for the personal not to be political, you would need a maximally liberated society, a society where the very idea of taking issue with another citizen's behavior would seem nonsensical, if that behavior is not literally criminal.
I think you are correct that this is indeed the Liberal perspective. I think it should be obvious to you and all others why this perspective is self-destructive. Behavior being criminal requires laws. How do those laws get written if you can't imagine objecting to someone else's behavior unless it's already against the law?
Human coexistence requires significant constraint of individual desires and will. Humans generally cannot "live secure in the knowledge that their life is their own"; the closest approach to this happy state is to get them to accept the constraints other humans place on them as normal and not really constraints at all, and the only way that happens is values-coherence.
I am not a full-on anarchist or libertarian in terms of the political systems that I think can produce good outcomes in the long term, but I do believe that "people can do what they want forever" is an essential component of the Good, and that government is good largely insofar as it gets us closer to that ideal (with the obvious epicycles about the government being empowered to infringe on freedoms in the interest of collective survival, as people need to be alive to be able to do what they want).
Maybe founding society on a goal that is obviously impossible to achieve or even closely approach is a bad idea? Values-diverse humans are going to want a lot of things that interfere with other humans against their will, and are going to have no way to calculate or enforce which infringements are minimal and which are unacceptable. Politics becomes a weapon, not a common tool, and then the whole thing burns down. You are currently watching this happen.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
8d ago
Because admitting they are up for debate means letting opponents speak and granting them legitimacy. If you can preemptively shut down the debate by declaring any other position beyond the pale, you win.
This is correct, but I've been arguing for some time that this isn't necessarily even bad behavior, because endlessly negotiating every facet of your existence with the entire rest of your society is antithetical to anything resembling a peaceful, prosperous existence. Such an existence depends on the personal not being political, and the way that happens is exactly by the formation of "common decency", of a set of norms and rules and behaviors that people conform to without significant argument or complaint, with those who cannot conform being ostracized.
We have to do this, but having done it, we forgot why it was necessary, and so burned down all the mechanisms required, and are now sort of rebuilding them badly, ad-hoc, and in a values-diverse environment they aren't made for.
I assume you are familiar with the phrase "with great power comes great responsibility." Do you recognize that it runs the other way as well? With great responsibility, comes great power? If so, what's the difference between power and dominance? If not, why not?
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
11d ago
I have no opinion on the quality control inspectors on the Artemis program in particular, but I would note that we have seen strong DEI pushes that trade off directly against high-stakes safety institutions like air traffic controllers and pilot training, along with pretty much every field in the whole country. This is not something I'd be super confident in asserting obviously wouldn't happen, especially given the degree to which space programs are very clearly run off politics rather than engineering.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
13d ago
To be clear, we are discussing a case where what they called up was used to excellent effect for three decades, and only now begins to turn on them when the entire country is coming apart at the seams.
It's not obvious from a pure power analysis perspective that they made the wrong play here. At least wait until there's some actual convictions, eh?
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
14d ago
You should not treat your political opponents as a homogenous group made of their most distasteful members
You should recognize when thoughts, positions, attitudes or memes become sufficiently widespread within a group to be normalized, such that it starts showing up in your day-to-day interactions.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
14d ago
While it was a bad shoot the current theory is his gun fired on its own.
To my knowledge, the evidence that his gun fired on its own consists of:
- His pistol being a SIG 320, which has a controversial reputation for uncommanded discharges
- Some people thinking they see the slide move in a handful of frames in a very grainy video.
From what I've seen, the latter point is very shaky, and is very pointedly not a claim the agency has made, to my knowledge. Digital video of this sort is not good at capturing gun mechanics at long range, poor lighting and in a confused environment. This same problem came up with the Mangioni shooting when people claimed the gun was a station-six or "welrod", as opposed to a semi-auto malfunctioning because it wasn't set up to work with a suppressor properly.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
15d ago
Mu.
Human rules cannot constrain human will. This does not mean that rules are useless. It does mean that they are not a general solution to the problem of human evil. You appear to be doing an absolutely fantastic job of demonstrating this reality with your arguments, so my congratulations on that. I will certainly be quoting your arguments in the future.
Logic is not a human rule. If you are appealing to it, you must be bound by it. I believe I am doing a fairly good job of being bound by logic.
If the above is not a satisfactory answer, I invite you to elaborate.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
15d ago
I can definitely say that any LE shooting someone who is restrained and is not pointing a gun at someone is outside of it is outside of it.
What about law enforcement shooting someone who is not pointing a gun and who they are not even attempting to restrain?
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
15d ago
To a first approximation, a supermajority of all journalists and editors, a supermajority of newspapers and TV news stations, A supermajority of the people and companies making "professional" books, music, movies, TV shows, video games, a supermajority of celebrities...
Right-wing media consists primarily of podcasts, youtube channels and streamers, and as of a couple of years ago nation-state actors were openly coordinating blanket censorship against them.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
15d ago
A while back, I would have said there wasn't one; small arms technology arguably peaked at the ar-15. In terms of form factor and general operation, I'd say that's still roughly the correct answer. Lately though, we're seeing more and more experiments with extremely high chamber-pressure cartridges and special bullet constructions that allow significant increases in performance, particularly against hard armor. I'm skeptical whether that increase is significant enough to represent the sort of improvement one sees between the 30s and 60s, but if you're looking for edge in terms of weapons, that'd probably be your best bet.
More generally, drones are legitimately revolutionary.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
16d ago
...All responses coming to mind sound too much like glazing. I guess I'll say that I think that's extremely cool, and leave it at that.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
17d ago
By all accounts "torture prison" is a perfectly reasonable way to describe CECOT, "concentration camp" is another word one could use and only be exaggerating a little.
what specific features of CECOT that distinguish it as a torture prison?
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
21d ago
the harder and more massive a projectile is, the worse the risk of collateral damage. Hard projectiles retain more energy from a penetration or deflection, larger projectiles have more energy.
Shotguns fire shot, ie lots of small, soft projectiles. These have low individual energy and are bad at retaining the energy they do have through an impact. Dedicated breaching rounds generally use something like compressed lead dust to greatly minimize the chance of a ricochet, but even with buckshot the danger is much, much lower than that presented by an active shooter.
The short version is that any reasonable risk assessment would have held that breaching the door was a good idea, even if they didn't have dedicated breaching rounds on-hand.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
21d ago
: individualism, freedom (especially speech), plus a certain "moral affinity for the strong".
I do not recognize a shared understanding of "freedom" or "free speech". European governments have expended considerable effort to curtail both my freedoms generally and especially my ability to speak. They have publicly discussed why doing so is a priority to them and strategized on how to do it better.
You: have a pathological hatred of the blue tribe, which you transfer onto europeans.
Hatred, certainly. Sinful, certainly. Pathological... Less so.
You are supporting a tribe that does not believe I should have a career or even a job. You are supporting a tribe that wants to destroy the economies of any place where legible concentrations of people like me live. That openly supports mobs beating people like me in the street. That does not believe people like me deserve equal protection under the law, and has been working for decades to deny it to us. That openly celebrates the murder of people like me, and the death of children like mine.
You are supporting a tribe that has, in my view, proved itself fundamentally hostile to every facet of my existence.
This might be workable if people like me were some vanishing, abnormal minority. In the real world, there are several dozen millions of us, and we retain considerable political, economic, and physical power, and we are currently negotiating a consensus on how to use that power to handle the above problems. Electing Trump was an interim product of that negotiation, but if and when he is expended, we will make additional attempts until we perceive the problem to be solved or until we are destroyed.
You are wrong that I am attempting to provoke a civil war in my home. You are wrong that those who are attempting to provoke a civil war in my home are having their efforts "frustrated". You are certainly wrong that the end result of this process is going to be crazy people charging naked into Greenland or Vancouver.
Dase is correct that this Greenland affair is downstream of the culture war. He is incorrect that the Culture War has been won in any meaningful sense by the election of Donald Trump to a second presidential term. The richest, most powerful country in the world cannot reach consensus on what its laws mean or how to enforce them. Its population has lost any semblance of values-coherence, and increasingly considers fellow countrymen an existential threat. For the last decade, people here have been treating this all as some sort of elaborate silly-goosery, but our actual inability to reach agreement on extremely fundamental questions of basic coexistence is a very big problem for people like yourself, who have offloaded most of the practicalities of your physical security to our military. Most of you seem to be handling this problem by hoping it goes away, that this is all a weird, momentary aberration, and that we will go back to presenting congenial Blueness into the future. I do not think that is going to happen, but you pays your money and you takes your chance.
Let's just wind this thing down. I am honestly tired of explaining the value of an alliance with a bloc with a huge economy and population and very similar interests.
Why would you suppose we have very similar interests?
despite being an Americanophile through and through.
What sort of American?
I want merz and everyone to tell trump to fuck off in no uncertain terms and stop giving him face-saving exits.
There's a considerable number of Americans who would welcome this, I'd imagine.
I don't want to live in Europe. I don't want to live anywhere like Europe. I don't want where I live to become more like Europe, even marginally. I would prefer actual war against the authorities to this happening. Your entire social consensus is inimical to what I view as fundamental human rights and basic principles of liberty. We are not friends in any meaningful sense; you are allied with my tribal enemies, and will be for the foreseeable future.
Again, Carney says it best:
You cannot “live within the lie” of mutual benefit through integration when integration becomes the source of your subordination.
I perceive integration with Europe one of the major sources of my subordination.
FCfromSSC
Nuclear levels of sour
22d ago
Here you go. Or perhaps that's not a "serious manner"? Do you disagree that the BBC and the social consensus it represents is deeply hostile to America's Red Tribe?
...You frame this as though this was some novel innovation on the part of an "anti-trans faction", but in fact entitlement to know and act on the genital/gonad configuration of strangers has been a bog-standard feature of society for centuries, and arguably back to the beginning of recorded history.
They didn't have to assert shit. This was all common knowledge for generations at least. Other people's genitalia, in the framing you present here, are and have been a matter of public interest for as long as we've had sex-segregated public spaces, which is a very, very long time.
This seems to me to be a remarkably dishonest description of what has actually been done, and by who.
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