site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of October 10, 2022

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

23
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

It feels like everyone in the space is just waiting for the penny of "building a model trained on unlicensed copyrighted art is a copyright violation" to drop. The real question is what happens next.

Interesting! I have the opposite intuition, that the forces behind Stable Diffusion remix culture are ascendant, and the forces behind lengthening and strengthening copyright are in decline. SOPA and PIPA were the inflection point, and that was a decade ago but the trends are like before but stronger. There's lots more money going into TV these days, but as Netflix stockholders have discovered, TV is naturally ephemeral and its producers are chained to the treadmill -- it doesn't hold value the way that film and music do, and the future of film and music has never looked dimmer. Meanwhile UGC is the future -- YouTube, Twitch, Roblox, Tiktok, Instagram. MrBeast is on his way to being a billionaire and there's a growing tidal wave of creators and influencers where that came from. And they're all in the business of ephemeral content too: content as performance, content as platform, content as brand, content as ambassador, content as identity, but never content as catalog. AI-generated art is unambiguously good for this crowd. It helps them churn out content faster and better.

Stable Diffusion and its progeny are good for the winners, and bad for the losers. The winners are stronger. Congress is old, but even it realized that Disney loses against Google and Wikipedia a decade ago, and in this new decade the embittered anime artists will get steamrolled by the influencers and their platforms.