This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
What about when you have to make a six hour (or longer) drive out into a rural area, where almost all of the roadway there are "off the grid" and have no electricity at all — then drive back the same way a day or two later? You know, like we'd do every summer weekend growing up, heading to our cabin in rural Alaska?
Outside of Anchorage, and maybe Juneau or Fairbanks, electric cars simply don't make sense here in Alaska.
I remember pointing this out to a bunch of electric-car enthusiasts at Caltech, back in the early 2000s, several times. I'd explain in detail the geographic and infrastructural realities of life in rural Alaska — the lack of electrical grid, hundreds of miles of wilderness between bits of civilization, Arctic conditions…
The ones who were engineering students working on developing electric cars were the more reasonable ones, mostly responding that, okay, sure, you guys will have to keep using gas cars a lot longer than everyone else, until the technology is someday good enough. Those who were "for the environment"-type boosters? They're the ones who would sneeringly reply about how nobody should be living in Alaska in the first place, and all those hicks will obviously be forced to move south to some big city, as they should be. (Bringing up the Natives got some interesting responses.)
I'm happy to concede that, at least for now, ICE cars make sense for the small niche of people who live in Alaska (about 0.2% of the US' population, by my estimate).
More options
Context Copy link
What I don't get from the second group is the pig-headedness refusal to accept workable compromises. Plug in hybrids are (cost and technical complexity aside, and the first's less a concern on the second hand market) mitigating almost all the issues of electric cars, but no one hates them as much as electric car fans. Daily commutes use no gas or a thimbleful of gas, and longer trips are not limited by infrastructure outside of already implemented gas stations.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link