This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I don't think the population is the biggest problem here, though I grant that once the ratchet has been turned they're too squeamish (or easily distracted, thanks to Trump) about turning it back. If anything I think the complacency is a result of a belief that the immigration system is mostly sensible, and people don't want drama about it like they have down south (people also always underestimate how many migrants come in, though they felt it post-COVID).
It's clear that the ruining of the immigration system was a result of Liberal ideology and business lobbying post-COVID. Carney just baldly stated that he cannot do what the public is asking for and end temporary migrants because business is very concerned about losing that spigot.
I don't really think there's an easy political solution to the fact that businesses want cheap labour and are able to lobby Ottawa to get it, especially given the Liberals' entrenched power. There are benefits to being a vetocracy with neither party being able to dominate like in the US. Theoretically you could remove some programs and put everything under a points-based system but the next Parliament (likely Liberal) can just undo it at will.
There's some argument that the Liberals figured it was money on the ground and they would get to slam the CPC for being racist and maybe they've learned their lesson. I don't buy it though. I think you have to do to parties what happened to the UK Tories before people learn. The lesson here is that they destroyed the reputation of an immigration system that was well-regarded enough that Trump made noises about adopting it in 2016 and they had a couple of years of anxiety and then got right back to governing.
More options
Context Copy link