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Culture War Roundup for the week of November 27, 2023

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It does mean those arguments are uncompelling to THEM, however. Because it means having to condemn their own ancestors, which lots of people are unwilling to do.

But so what? So people don't condemn their ancestors when they should. Now what? Doors open, come one come all?

If you want the current polity to actually limit immigration, that's what you have to contend with. From my perspective if the US decides to limit or not limit immigration, that is largely up to them. If they want to go with the nation of immigrants myth that they are emotionally invested in, that is entirely their right to do so, whether I agree or not.

Believe me, I acknowledge what I have to contend with, and I lament it.

The presence of an unrepentant thief who says, "thievery should be punished, but not me, I'm one of the good ones" does indeed call into question his motivation to make that argument. Largely it's what the non thieves think that should hold most sway. The thief by his very nature is unable to be objective about it.

Right, so forget him and look at his actual argument. You seem to not want to look at the actual argument and only focus on the person making it.

Right, so forget him and look at his actual argument. You seem to not want to look at the actual argument and only focus on the person making it.

No, you misunderstand. I am saying that for most people that is how they look at it. Hence why they make the attacks you were wondering why they made. The correctness of the argument you are making is mostly moot (and I haven't commented on it for just that reason).

Your question is answered by how people operate, that they use emotion and pattern matching etc. So you or I making the same argument as someone else will get different reactions. In other words, identity does indeed matter. If you want to make arguments that will advance your cause, understanding and accounting for that is important. A white Canadian (or Brit!) immigrant making an argument against immigration is going to be a hard sell, regardless of whether the argument is 100% correct or not. How right you are is less important than how right you are perceived to be.

Gotchya, sorry I misunderstood. Your point is certainly well taken.