@Throwaway05's banner p

Throwaway05


				

				

				

					3 followers  

					follows 0 users  

					

					
joined 2023 January 02 15:05:53 UTC
				

				

				

				

				

				

					
				

				

				
				
				

				
User ID: 2034


				
				
				

			

		

	














	


		


			



	

		

			

			

				

					

						

							
						

						

							
							

								
Throwaway05


								

								

								
								
								

								
							
					
 
				


				

				
				
				

				

					3 followers  

					follows 0 users  

					joined 2023 January 02 15:05:53 UTC
				


				
					

					
No bio...

				

				

				

				

				

					

					

					
					
					

					
User ID: 2034


					
					
					
				

			


					

						
					



		

	

 











			
			

			
			

			




	


		

			
‎

			

				
				

					Hour
					Day
					
					Month
					Year
					All
				

			


			
‎

			

	
	

	 Hot Bump Top Bottom Old Controversial Comments
	



		

	






	

		
		

		
		
	

	

  







		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
Search on YouTube for "Lindsay Clancy Trial: Forensic Psychiatrist Explains Psychosis, Malingering, & Insanity Defense."


No direct link because I remember hearing something about YouTube links showing the account source and I'm too lazy to figure that out.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					


This in particular sounds like the whole thing rests on "the experts" having 20-30 IQ points on the people they're investigating, and being reasonably confident they'll be doing the manipulating, rather than being manipulated. I don't think that's a reasonable assumption here, and I'm really not seeing anything that's supposed to catch this case in particular.




Come on now, for forensic evaluations to exist in court without being torn about by the defense they need to have paid attention to things like inter-rater reliability. Check out the Personality Assessment Inventory (PAI) as an example.


Also, as I've said elsewhere - I am not an expert on postpartum psychosis, but I've seen phsyciains who have seen a bunch of PPP go "yes that this is what it looks like sometimes, thank god my patient didn't do anything this bad." Having exposure to the actual patient population with these disease should mean something.


I wrote elsewhere in one of the chains on the transgender thing, but it's more driven into medicine than out of and from medicine.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
To some extent this gets into the territory of highly jurisdictional stuff (and individual physician interpretation - the law is fuzzier than you might imagine), but as an example:


The voices told me to kill my family and I did it but I knew that wasn't the right thing and couldn't help myself = guilty.


The voices told me to kill my family and I did it because if the voices told me to do it must be the right thing to do = NGRI.


The latter is less common than you'd think. For instance a lot of violent voice are labeled as demons, bullies, and other such things and when assessed patients will say "yeah I knew I shouldn't have listened to Satan because he's Satan."


I'm not really sure if this is a sensible line to draw but it seems to be where it is drawn a lot of the time.


A case like Charles Whitman is probably optimal to think about because his thinking is otherwise totally clear but his violence button was stuck on because of the brain tumor.


Organized and able to plan AND also untethered from reality is thankfully extremely rare, but it does happen, the intuition that it doesn't make sense is more from lack of being common than actual possibility.


I'd say most people this sick are totally disorganized, uselessly impulsive, or both. But not all.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
I think the question they were asked was "did the state prove beyond a reasonable doubt that she was not mentally impaired* during the killings."


The state was never going to be able to do that the law in MA is ridiculous.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
The trans issue is complicated because while their are certainly elements of classic medical-fads, it's more of a religious preoccupation of the majority of people involved in healthcare that's shared in their cultural milieu, even with that being said (and I'm 100% a trans-skeptic) the jury is still out and we will probably find it's a mixture of legitimate pathology that responds well to treatment and misdiagnosed social contagion. The legal and social environment needs to clear before we can find out but it's not like medicine is leading the charge on trans issues, it's following instructions from the poltico-religious mothership.


I actually don't think homosexuality counts even if I expanded my time window, deviance is a cultural context, increase cultural acceptance changes it from pathology to accepted behavior. Commonly discussed around here is the age of consent. Legal and social changes make something more or less pathological.


People like to complain about ADHD/Autism over-dx but the field's understanding of the situation is just fine. You see individual and organization malfeasance for profit but even more common than that is patient's lying to seek secondary gain. Neither of these are problems with diagnostic criteria. The field is also constantly trying to calibrate to assess for pathologizing normal human behavior.


Re: memory, as I stated elsewhere we were just discovering how memory works in the 70s and as that was investigated adjustments needed to made. Good science involves adjusting frameworks as we learn more. For instance modern understanding of memory posits that recall is like taking a book of a shelf, reading, and writing a new book before putting it back (instead of reading a book and then putting it back). A world in which you do have that insight has a very different relationship with repressed memories.


My understanding of the DID craze is that it was basically just one guy and his followers evangelizing the idea and it got really popular in the lay-world because it's a cool idea and sounds like a neat illness to have. You'll always have individual cranks and sometimes they do some limited persuasion (see: Vitamin C and sepsis, which I have bitched about before).


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					


The point is that psychiatry experts, and people who trust them, like you, believe they have information, training, and experience [in ways that would inform them better than the layman], when, in fact, that is false.




I am very confused, you seem to be simultaneously claiming that psychiatry is on par with homeopathy and criticizing me for complaining that you are making that claim.


Pick. Is it bullshit or is it not. If you think it's bullshit, prove it. Given that you required significant redirection to note the difference between psychology and psychiatry I don't think you can.


Additionally psychiatry does areas where it is 100% as predictable and reliable as aerospace engineering. These are more limited than we'd like, but antipsychotic goes on, psychosis goes off and BZD goes on, catatonia goes off are extremely well understood biological phenomena. Yeah we don't understand everything about them, but just because we don't full understand how ice skates work doesn't mean physics is broken.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
Yeah fair.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
The experts in this case (both testifying and misc. people commenting) are essentially the people in the legal system/healthcare whose specific job is to tell if people are full of shit. The field has well developed and researched things like forensic inventories that are designed to catch people who exaggerate or mislead about their symptoms. These tools are not readily available online for the obvious reasons, but to give an example of the kind of thing you would do - if someone is pretending to have cognitive deficits to avoid blame you can ask them a question that even someone with severe retardation or dementia can answer like "what's 2+2." Anyone who can't answer that is going to be highly suspicious. The actual assessment is going to be a much more robust and complicated elaboration on that sort of concept.


It's also going to involve actual exposure to similar cases, knowledge of the criminal profiles involved (what does narcissistic family annihilation actually look, how does it contrast with borderline, suicidal, and so on).


The field has some limitations of course but doctors are doing this every day all over the country and it works fine and is a standard part of the legal system.


How many murderers have you actually met? I've treated hundreds and I'm not even a forensic psychiatrist - and even with that caveat I could guess the type of crime sometimes from doing my unrelated business. Resnick has probably evaluated 1,000s of killers and he's made a career out of sorting them and even wrote the book on it.


I'm not 100% convinced of the argument but I do have enough information to understand that expertise can exist on these matters and I'm seeing a bunch line up in a certain way...


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
I'm not sure I see how that follows.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
I'd recommend you watch the podcast if you are legitimately interested in hearing the argument and are potential open to having your view changed.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
At Resnick's level of prestige he gets to investigate, charge, and ask them if they want his conclusions (with a potential need to get someone else). It's absolutely possible he's gone senile or decided to collect one last case or get some money for his grandkids. It's more likely that he's involved because it's a big case and he found what he found.


In a more normal case you are just as likely to have the witnesses conclusion change the defense's tack as to keep rolling the dice on witnesses until you get what you want.


And yes it's not clear if this is doing that much for Clancy, perhaps her defense sees a way out here, but realistically she's just likely to end up in a different kind of facility (with women's prison probably being better than the psychiatric hospital). Perhaps its safety concerns as she might get murdered in prison. Perhaps its just a desire to clear her name.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
My initial post mentioned how both expert witnesses and general experts (with no incentive) seem to be mostly lining up in support of the defense's narrative.


This was a shock to me and part of why I changed my view.


Also keep in mind, as mentioned in my linked podcast - you can hire an expert witnesses and pay them and have them generate work product you do not want. It happens.


Resnick absolutely could have seen Clancy, been paid, and been like nah you don't want me to testify. Instead he helped the defense.


From this guy's bio:


"He has provided consultation in many high profile cases including:  Jeffrey Dahmer, Susan Smith, Timothy McVeigh, Andrea Yates, Scott Petersen, Brian Mitchell (kidnapper of Elizabeth Smart), Theodore Kaczynski (Unabomber) and Casey Anthony."


There's a reason I'm so pissy on this topic.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
Psychiatry is medicine, and it has the same problems - money and ethical concerns provide significant limitations in research over some scientific disciplines, but the problems are driven by tensions like that and the reality of research dealing with the most complex organism we have access to. Yes it's not pure math, but it's closer to that than homeopathy.


Aerospace as much as anything else has people publishing to avoid perishing and corner cutting because of finances, if we are going to take it that far.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
You claimed:


"The difference between aerospace engineering and homeopathy/psychology is that the former has loads of empirical evidence and concrete track record of success as detectable and measurable by a layman in everyday life, while the latter 2 not only lack empirical evidence but often go directly against it."


Again we are talking about psychiatry, not psychology, but both have plenty of incredibly rigorous, replicable, and reliable research and conclusions. As with anything they also have elements of bleeding edge and hobby research that are questionable.


Critical thinking involves using basic investigation to discriminate between things that are questionable and things that have a strong basis.


Instead you try to imply that psychiatry, psychology, and homeopathy are all the same level of reliable.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
The majority of patients have no symptoms of discontinuation, and for those that do a simple taper is more than sufficient. Prozac self-tapers. Paxil is an exception but doesn't have any modern use cases. A different class of medication (SNRIs) cause "brain zaps" and are legitimately hard to get off of.


Side effects for the vast majority of patients consist of mild transient symptoms on initiation AND the more problematic side effect which is sexual side effects. This is relatively easy to treat if it's endorsed, or addressed by switching to another medication.


Very few patients have side effects while on steady use other than the sexual side effects.


Significant issues with SSRIs do occur with certain subtypes of patients, usually those are patients who have another type of issue (ex: Bipolar, Borderline) and don't need that kind of medication, or have predominately anxious phenotypes for which medication is significantly less reliable choice and are better treated with therapy.


They do have the black box warning for SI but I don't think any PCP or Psychiatrist I've ever talked to has observed it, it's probably not real and got stuck because of cautious regulators.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
These are probably more mixed examples than you'd think. To my understanding repressed memory theory was a longstanding vestigium from the old days of psychiatry, once the field became more scientific, medicine got more tools, and we learned how memory worked it did get deprecated. This is science working as we'd hope with people making adjustment when more data is available. As you note it did take awhile.


This specific issue (especially on the satantic panic end) and the transgenderism issue that someone else posted are also examples of medical authority being coopted for politics, which is a problem, a known fail state, probably most famously known in COVID but also famously a problem in authoritarian states (ex: Sluggish Schizophrenia). This is absolutely a fair criticism but isn't a reason to toss out the whole thing.


The SSRI studies are part of a wider conversation which is complicated and confusing and hard to summarize here.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
Anti-social personality disorder is a common cause of crime and presents no protection from consequences of that crime.


The majority of crime is driven by mental illness but that does not mean it is accused. Just because you robbed the store to buy drugs doesn't mean you should get away with it.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
Absolutely but what do people with those types of feelings do? They lash out impulsively crashing their car. They grab a weapon at hand and do something. Most commonly they attack the husband.


The mixture of poor/irrational planning and premeditation supposedly leans towards this kind of pathology.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
I hear you that it looks weird, this is why initially I was team "she did it for some other reason" but when people I know and trust who have more expertise than me stake their reputations professionally (Resnick) and didactically (the podcast I linked) then you gotta have a think.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
SSRIs are one of the most commonly used medication types in the world, to my knowledge there is no reliable evidence of long term harms beyond the known side effects. The side effect profile is one of the best in psychiatric medicine, in fact we do use them despite the fact that they have less clinical effect because the harms are so low. Research on effect size does not generate enthusiasm but anyone who has actually prescribed knows they work just not for all patients. They are also not highly addictive. Some can generate a mostly mild withdrawal syndrome but some don't. Something that is highly addictive is Heroin. Heroin and Zoloft are not in the same category.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
This is true but you've already narrowed the solution space down quite a bit once you are talking about this from every motivation in the world to a much smaller subset with a higher percentage of possible explanations involving type of illness the insanity defense applies to.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
Because most people's model of what the insanity defense means don't accurately reflect the case law.


It applies only to a very small subset of crimes complicated by mental illness, and generally does not lead to any increased freedom in the community or getting away with it.


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
I have no objection to people attempting to evaluate for themselves the persuasiveness of the arguments, the research, the literature, and so on. It is very common here and elsewhere for people to just go "no fuck you they must be woke and im mad about covid" which is the exact level of analysis exhibited by the "he did it cause he's a gemini" people.


Psychiatry is fundamental a medical field which means that inter rater reliability, effect size, and so on are baked in and seriously researched. They do have some problems but most of that is structural (ex: SSRIs clearly work, why does the literature not show that to some extent?...well medical research is hard).


While medical research has all kinds of problems the stance here is comically overblown.


For instance most of the over-dx problems make sense in context (for instance giving people labels so they can get insurance coverage for therapy, scummy patients/doctors in the ADHD market, and so on).


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
One of the things that changed my view on this is that I learned that a known (and incredibly dangerous) presentation of PPP in the literature is the waxing and waning presentation that would have explained LC's action.


To some extent it makes sense given our suspicion of the mechanism (and in contrast with normal schizophrenia etc).


				

				

						

							

								
							

						


						
					

				
			


			
			
			
				

			
		

	






		

			
			
				Culture War Roundup for the week of August 31, 2026
			
		

	

	

	

		
			

			

				

			

		

			


				

					
Right, I've personally interacted with convicts who said something like "yes I knew it was wrong but the moon goblins told me to" and it's like nope you knew it was wrong, to prison with you.