This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
This part seems shoehorned into your post without you really making the connection. I don't think it accurately portrays the situation in Gaza, which is part of the reason it simply does not fit the pattern. Gaza, simply put, may be a carnival of cruelty, but it is self imposed. The people of Gaza prefer being poor and hungry to being non-violent and cooperative neighbors. They have expressed this again and again. And part of the problem with that is you assertion that a "vast majority" of US politicians stand with Israel is false. Most will mouth words in that direction from time to time, but particularly Democrats, are quick to criticize any effective military or law enforcement action by Israel. Because of this, the US imposes significant restraints on Israeli action (preventing the ethnic cleansing/genocide or even just a real blockade, for example) which means Hamas always has the whip hand in Gaza. Gazans largely like Hamas, it appears, but those who don't fear Hamas much more than they fear Israel. For as bad as some actions have been on a small scale, Netanyahu is never going to condone raping the wives of Hamas militants while their babies burn to death in an over. And I don't think Israel needs to go THAT far to win this war. But from Vietnam to Afghanistan, we have consistently learned that occupations with a soft touch are doomed to failure.
ISTM the most clear and least cruel path forward is a worldwide Israeli green light to level any building, whether it be a school, hospital, or bunker, where there is reasonable suspicion a Hamas person or article is present. Realistically, this is most of Gaza. Following a WWII Tokyo like bombing campaign over the majority of the territory, perhaps the people of Gaza will elect new leadership and come to an armistice. That could, theoretically be followed by one of a few scenarios:
I would expect under #1, both would quickly become very well off states provided they don't go back into the terrorism game. Trump often spouts BS, but he is absolutely correct that they are both excellent locations for a prosperous state, given the right leadership and populace. I expect, for example, if you put a bunch of Iowans in Gaza and Nebraskans in West Bank, both would swiftly approach or exceed Israel in GDP/Capita.
Why? What makes you think they'll exceed Israel?
Do you think the ultra Orthodox are dragging the gang down?
There is that, but also I just think Iowans and Nebraskans are generally pretty good at self-governance, and they'd have none of the built up bureaucracy that Israel has from its early years that were much more socialist in origin. It is still a fairly dysfunctional government as we've seen with the Supreme Court's battles with Bibi.
Generally busting a bunch of Americans out of the complicated regulatory environment that exists in America would usually result in explosive growth.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link