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Forget the US. What benefit do blacks like Johnson specifically get?
They compete with blacks for jobs (or spending in the case of cities with right to shelter) and now there's not even a pretense that they'll be a permanent Democratic client base like them to push for policies African-Americans would want. Clearly the emerging Democratic majority with a bunch of minorities all loyal to one another is not going to happen.
Hell, insofar as they do join up they dilute AA's hold on the party. And, because they're not fully captured there's more of an incentive to pander to them. As Biden said: unlike the black community Latinos are diverse.
the illegals flood cities and protect the Democrat power centers by keeping those who would threaten their power out
they don't need to be loyal to each other, they need to be united in opposition to another group which has worked pretty well for quite a long time
the loyalty to each other is solved through an ethnic spoils system which we already see in cities across the US (and have for quite some time, e.g., Los Angeles)
cities across the US are controlled by people who govern badly, let crime and other scams run rampant and, whether this is intentional or not, the result of this is they keep normal, functional Americans out of those cities which protects the machine politics of those cities
Right, and this is why the cities with the largest foreign-born fraction (Miami, San Jose, New York, Los Angeles, San Francisco) are the poorest, most crime-ridden cities in the country, while the cities containing the lowest fraction of foreign-born Americans (Detroit, Louisville, Memphis, Indianapolis, Oklahoma City) are beacons of safety and prosperity.
On the one hand, selection effects are absolutely a thing, and will explain at least some of that trend. On the other hand it sure doesn't look to me like foreigners turn cities into ethnic spoils engines, except to the extent that they make cities wealthy and some of that wealth goes to spoils.
ethnic doesn't need to be foreign and foreign doesn't need to be illegals
the violence/crime stats for other demographics is so low compared to blacks, near the entire effect you're pointing out is explained by % black population down to the zipcode level
this outlier effect supplants any other effect because you've chosen a "top five" approach, but this argument doesn't work against the point of the post
places with high numbers of illegals are dirty, overcrowded, dysfunctional, and foreign, in addition to them having higher crime and being generally low-trust
that one "native" group also has this effect isn't mutually exclusive to illegals; the fact that Jackson, Mississippi is a dirty, dysfunctional, violent place while having few foreigners doesn't mean illegals don't have a similar effect on the places they concentrate which keeps regular functional Americans out
which reinforces the point I'm making; these cities being run poorly and protecting illegals (and black criminals) buttresses the political machines there because it keeps regular functional Americans out, even willing to commute multiple hours to live outside of these places
wait, are you implying cities like NYC and LA don't have ethnic spoils systems now or in the past (some of the ethnics being foreigners)?
I'm implying that ethnic spoils systems aren't a particularly interesting or significant part of what's going on with NYC or LA. If you ask people "what is New York an engine of" or "what is LA an engine of" you're very unlikely to get an answer like "ethnic spoils" even from the most race realist types.
This sounds like a problem that can be solved through the approach of "don't live in such places". There are plenty of such places. I will say, having grown up in a majority-hispanic area of southern california that "overcrowded, dysfunctional, and foreign" is not a description that fits LA very well. LA is a sprawling, wealthy, soulless suburb stretching to the horizon with occasional pockets of city sprinkled throughout.
People who commute for hours into LA are largely doing it because they're priced out of anywhere closer, not because they're trying to get away from immigrants. The exurbs have more immigrants, not fewer - e.g. Victorville (most stereotypical LA exurb) is 55% hispanic and only 18% white.
even if true, what does asking this open ended question to "people" demonstrate?
describing LA and NYC as "ethnic spoils systems" is accurate whether or not the above is a true statement
the first time I encountered this idea and these specific examples was from my elderly communist black professor; perhaps she qualifies as "even from the most race realist types"
right, which is what I claimed was the effect in my first comment
it's also a problem which can be solved through the approach of "deport illegals and other foreigners before they take over neighborhoods and fundamentally change it" bringing us back to the subject issue
Again, see Detroit, Birmingham, etc. Basically no immigrants and yet they are the way they are. Keep foreigners out before they change the neighborhood did not work in those cases. Why expect it will in others? Especially why expect that when the most desirable cities to live in are the ones with the most foreigners?
Okay, so because blacks have turned Detroit, once one of the finest cities in the world, into a dirty, disorganized, and violent shithole, therefore illegals don't also have the effect of making places dirty, disorganized and violent (and foreign)?
Like because "deport illegals" isn't an answer to every problem which results in dirty, disorganized, and violent cities, therefore it's never an answer to any problem?
This isn't a strong argument.
it's odd to imply because the nice parts of Manhattan, Brooklyn, and Queens exist with a relatively small number of illegals and the enormous pile of money that is NYC exists (i.e., the reason it's a "desirable city"), therefore the dirty, disorganized, violent, and low-trust neighborhoods in Brooklyn, Queens, and increasingly the Bronx where the bulk of the illegals actually live can just be waved away
I've corrected you twice around my use of the word "illegals" and "ethnic" as opposed to "foreign." "Foreign-born," i.e., "foreigner," is perhaps the worst category for this discussion because it includes vastly different groups which are not interchangeable. Your repeated attempts to make that category the topic of discussion despite my repeated corrections just muddies the waters and is dishonest.
No, because "deport illegals" being the answer to some problems doesn't mean it's the answer to all problems. "Many of our cities are dirty, disorganized, and violent" doesn't seem like one of those problems, at least not for the dirtiest, most disorganized, and most violent of them.
In a very similar way to how "racism exists sometimes" does not mean "racial justice is the solution to all problems, including things like climate change", but people who care a lot about racial justice have a tendency of thinking that fixing that will fix everything. With results that... well, you saw the results too.
And I'm worried that we're going to see the same pattern we saw there except this time it's going to be "we deported a bunch of people and observed that the problems we care about haven't improved, but that's because there are still illegals, we just need to spend even more money and suspend even more civil liberties in the effort to deport them all and then things will be good".
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