This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
It doesn't matter. De facto a college degree is just a four year vacation. It's still a good investment to make, but less so.
Now, the motte is going to chime in that there's an absolute dingbat making six figures answering emails somewhere. I believe that, even if this isn't actually the boss's boss's mistress. But if you replace this person with a random trucker or construction worker, you will discover why this person's job required a college degree. There are of course jobs that require a college degree and don't need one- they don't pay six figures, but they exist. They also have a lower early-termination rate than their equivalent which doesn't require a college degree.
I happen to work an office job at a trucking company. A lot of our office guys don't have college degrees, a lot of them are former drivers, and I would say that my employer is more willing to take a chance and invest resources into training someone than many (They hired me with a stale humanities degree and driving/dispatching experience from outside of trucking.), but as a rule the managers are either 50+ or have a degree. Similarly, while it's likely true that the best dispatcher would have driving experience there's a good chance that a random driver plopped into the office either isn't bright enough, lacks the necessary computer/literacy skills, or lacks the disposition/patience to sit in an office all day and be professional when things start going wrong. That, and the sort of drivers who have those skills make more money driving than the dispatchers and either aren't interested in management or are stuck in the golden handcuffs such that they can't afford to stick out the lower office paycheck long enough to make terminal manager.
And FWIW as someone who was a lousy student who nevertheless graduated with a 3.5 from a state school on scholarship I think at minimum a college degree demonstrates some combination of industriousness and competence (maybe not what you would call "smart", but one does have to attend some amount of classes, complete some amount of assignments, and pass some amount of tests) or at least some variety of talent to pass those classes with a smoke and mirrors show. Was I a pizza delivery driver first, an alcoholic second, and college student third? Pretty much, but I did write those papers, pass those tests, and was able to triage assignments and exams such that I made the grades I needed to with a minimum of effort. Was it a waste of an opportunity to be educated and/or network my way into a real career? Probably. Did pulling it off when I could've just dropped out and gone full townie demonstrate something? I'd like to think so.
Oh, and we tend to shuffle our dingbats into the safety department.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link