site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of November 10, 2025

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

5
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

Except it is patently clear that the audience for this public shaming doesn't exist anymore.

It never needed an audience. It's always been a relatively small number of people doing it--these people just have a lot of power. It doesn't matter that, for instance, Disney refuses to make white men a big part of its audience most of the time. So they lose some money, they don't care. They aren't going to go out of business or get fired because of it.

Also, bear in mind that woke media can get popular. The audience is probably race blind and sex blind in the way that used to be considered good and now marks you as a fascist. They don't actually object to the media being woke at all unless it's very over the top (lectures about how straight men are evil, 100% female cast, etc.)--it's just that if the writers put a high priority on woke, they probably put a low priority on everything else such as good writing, so the odds are against woke things getting an audience. But it can still happen (Baldur's Gate 3 for instance).

They don't actually object to the media being woke at all unless it's very over the top (lectures about how straight men are evil, 100% female cast, etc.)

I'd argue that's the difference between "woke" and "progressive/raceblind" media. Like, if you have a new superhero that you're going to launch, and you decide that it'll be a Latina woman and most of the story is going to revolve around a hispanic community in Texas - that's not a problem at all. I may not be interested in it, but I'm not going to say it's necessarily bad. If you're going to take a superhero who was "pale, male, and stale", and make them into a Latinx girlboss who don't need no man - then you've just made a garbage piece of media.

Baldur's Gate 3 is actually a great example of something I'd say isn't actually "woke" - it's just progressive. I'm going to compare it to the recently developed "Siege of Dragonspear" expansion for Baldur's Gate 1&2 - if you aren't familiar, one of the major characters in Siege of Dragonspear has a fairly big arc where it is revealed that they are transgendered, and it's considered to be a big deal that they're living their gender expression and they're so brave for doing so. However, if anyone here has played Baldur's Gate 1 - you'll recall that one of the first items you get in the game (literally in the third explorable area) is a belt of gender changing. In a world where there exists a magic item common enough that a random ogre can have one - being trans just doesn't make any sense. By comparison, Baldur's Gate 3 has progressiveness "in the water" so to speak - characters are gay, multicultural, etc. But from my recollection, it doesn't have any major plot points that rely on progressive shibboleths to make sense - there's no "ACAB" making it so you can never trust the guards, there's no situation where the only competent person is a female POC who is being shouted down by the bumbling men, and there's no plot point that relies on realizing all orcs are actually noble and that the orc opposing you must be a mind controlled victim.