site banner
PaperclipPerfector  4mo ago (text post)   25448 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of November 17, 2025

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

7
Top Bottom Old Controversial Comments
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

Whilst I've only worked in completely male dominated places, the stories I get from my acquaintances who are in more diversity are always along the lines of 'There is an obvious sex based preference being acted out every single day, which is always to my detriment' but there is never anything concrete. Just an endless stream of second hand examples.

Tracing the chain of causality that drove a bitter loser to complain about how unfair the system is, is practically impossible. But when so many of my smartest acquaintances tell the same story I'm left wondering how it's possible they are all just delusional.

If they are not all delusional, one would ask why nothing gets done about the state of affairs, and the answer is obvious. If you complain you are a loser. The big bosses of society have already decided that things will be like this. You don't have a say. And because it is true that anyone who notices and complains about this comical state of affairs is a loser, they can't do anything. They can't quit. They are completely replaceable and there is no place for them to go. They are not just losers, they are humiliated losers. Every day their hard work means less because there is some frivolous gender crap sucking up energy. It's in their face every single day and they have to suffer it. To that extent your post is pointing at a very important reality.

The only problem I have is with the men who don't notice or complain. Chances are their predicament is no better than that of a complainer. But because they don't notice or complain they delude themselves to feel superior to the losers who outed themselves as being emotionally disturbed by how things are. But it's fake. They are all in the same lot.

There's an interesting Culture War drama example of this on my YouTube feed. Comedian Akaash Singh had a small podcast beef with some manosphere guys. Akaash, along with his married friend, made it clear that they were not the losers, but the other guys. They were happily married, not complaining, the manosphere guys were unmarried losers complaining about women. Well, a few years later it looks like Akaash is, to borrow an old phrase, whipped. Similar to Will Smith and such. So whilst it might be true the manosphere guys were delusional losers complaining about women, it's obvious Akaash was also a delusional loser defending them.

Now, I don't think you can derive a lot of good truth from e-celeb drama on the nature of Akaash's marriage. Maybe it's being portrayed unfairly. But it's a good example to remind us of the fact that the world is filled with losers who won't look reality in the eye no matter what. And that they are delusional in all directions.

Two relevant comments from 2014 on a social conservative blog I used to visit:

It was clear from the beginning that this was never about legal equality, per se (although that was an important part of it), but rather about social equality – that is, forcing everyone to treat same sex couplings the same way they do opposite sex couplings, under penalty of severe social sanction if they do not do so.

There is a template for this – the template that was used for race, and the template that was used for sex. It’s just being applied in a new context, but the template is the same, and that’s why it will work. It has a track record of working, after all. In 20 years, if not sooner, these kinds of discussions will be viewed the same way as discussions about race that took place in the 1950s-70s – anachronistic, bigoted, and something worthy of eye-rolls and headshakes.

They’ve won, folks. On this issue, they have won – it’s going to be treated like being an open racist or an open sexist – in other words, severe social and professional sanction, all unofficial of course, but powerful all the same. It will have the effect of stamping it out. Just like with cigarettes. It’s the way we do things here – slap a scarlet letter on it, and stamp it out through social sanction.

We will be permitted to have dissenting views, but only privately – as in, not expressing them in public, not outside of our homes, not outside of our churches. Not in the professional sphere, nor the political sphere, nor the extended social sphere. Over time, this will lead to the ideas dying out, slowly, over time, other than for a committed radical core. Which will be seen as being radical and fringe.

Of course, that’s not a call for surrender. They have won for the time being, but no merely human victory is ever eternal. Their star will wane eventually, and we must be ready when it does. But for now, it’s a time to consolidate, to reflect on what went so badly wrong, and to protect to the extent that we can without making ourselves martyrs needlessly.

There will be a "virtual gulag" in which dissidents are excluded from society. They lose their jobs and can't find any work other than subsistence work, if that. They are excluded from churches and places of worship. They will be banned from public accommodations such as restaurants and hotels; banned from doing business or purchasing goods and services. It won't be official. It will just be that word gets around about who the dissidents are, and no one will do business with or socialize with them at all. They will starve to death, literally, in plain sight.

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.


Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.


New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!


Rules


Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats