This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
"Aren't representative" isn't even the half of it. Educated urban circles aren't even representative of educated urban circles, anyone with 2 braincells to rub together is in full Havel's Greengrocer mode, and the ones that do actually side with the regime are having palpitation over populist parties getting more and more mainstream.
Any country that bothered publishing statistics on the subject showed that non-European immigrants cost more money than they bring. The whole idea of solving our financial issue with them was ridiculous from the start.
I should clarify. I purposely left it at 'they need immigrants'. Europe's current immigration strategy (or lack there of) is a total mess. As it is now, it's bad. It's quite bad.
I still think the problem of 'how to get good immigrants' is easier than 'how do we fix our industrial policy' or 'how do we make our people have more kids'. Therefore there is an urgency attached to it. The latter 2 are definitely the more worthwhile pursuits, but it is what it is.
Could be. Happened with Trump 2016, Brexit and Modi 2014.
I don't think there's enough good immigrants to go between Europe, the US, Japan, Korea, and if China ever joins that club, you can forget about it. I'm also pretty sure that deindustrialization and depopulation are deliberate policy, rather than innocent bumbling around by the bureaucrats.
Nothing quite so drastic, but an educated urbanite won't be caught dead sharing no-no opinions in public, so even their relatively low numbers just won't become apparent in conversation. Though funnily enough it might come up with parents fretting over the political opinions of their kids, their sons in particular.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link