This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
As far as I'm aware most of the narrative about inevitability is of the more 'timeless' Thucydides Trap flavor. However it's worth noting that I do sometimes read English-language Chinese propaganda: they are actually pushing this narrative! Their hope is that they can co-opt US intellectuals into thinking "we're too smart to fall into this silly trap". This is accompanied by (empty) blustering about how important "self-determinism" is and how they would never intervene in other countries' affairs (lol).
In parallel, they're trying to degrade American pride and nationalism more generally. No one is more happy than China (yes, even more than Russia IMO) at the flood of articles about homelessness in the US, racial violence, inequality, government dysfunction, etc). Interestingly, they seem to have tried to learn from the Communists of yesteryear: rather than explicitly promote left-wingers, they think that they can win on a pure negative-messaging platform. They will brag about how China can 'just do things' and is clean, orderly, family-friendly even, but they don't care if it catches on, they just want to provide a contrast. They don't care about promoting something like the IWW or Comintern or whatever. They view money as a more powerful ideological tool (internationally) than actual ideology. Of course, some of this is necessarily defensive: they don't want democracy to look attractive to Chinese people. But it's interesting to me nonetheless that this is the strategy that they've chosen to appeal to the Western intellectuals.
I do think China is less likely to intervene in other countries affairs then the US or Russia
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link