This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I think of them as a big blob with that 1800's political cartoon of the fat rich guy, to be honest.
I don't really care about the raw numbers, and in the context of this complaint not even the percentage very much. It's the immunity from consequence that gets me.
I lived in an aggressively poor country during my early life; the richest guy around was much richer relative to everyone else than anybody but elon theses days, but he was still tied in to the society. He experienced the friction of living in a place, with certain values and expectations, and he reaped the rewards by displaying noblesse oblige to us peasants, but he also risked the punishment of social approbation all the way down to a group of dudes showing up outside if his compound with the knowledge that they were the final arbiter of proper behavior.
A business I make use of in my business was acquired by private capital, saddled with a load of debt, gutted, had it's property sold out from under it and then leased back, and finally went out of business this year.
In a well functioning society, the people that do that shit would not be rewarded with power and money. They would be poor, possibly in prison, maybe tarred and feathered and run out of town, perchance fucking dead.
That's what I mean about consequences I guess; in china it's at least theoretically possible that if you damage production or distribution in a way that pisses lots of people off and materialy damages the economy but isn't illegal, the big hand of the state might come down out of the sky and slap your wrist, instead of what happens in the US which is a big shrug and a 'well, we only have absolute power over life and death and a popular mandate and all three branches of government, there's nothing we can do'
PE/VCs are yet another category we could make in our list of the super rich; I don't know but I'd assume the majority of PE founders are going to be the multi-millionaires, apart from the very successful few like Blackrock and KKR.
There's a whole 'nother load of misconceptions about PE that could form a topic on their own, but rest assured that the stories of leveraged buyouts leading to rapid bankruptcy are almost always disasters for the PE investors.
As for this, I have a few Chinese bridges to sell to you.
Back in the day one of my first Chinese employers was this sociopathic woman who somehow took an ironclad business and pissed away a ton of money and goodwill, seriously enraging all our customers and partners. And these were some wealthy and powerful people, but did it matter?
Of course not, because she was even more powerful. Her dad was a major player in Anhui's CCP, so she was essentially untouchable.
Some of other posts made essentially this point below. China does not remove billionaires/the elite from their system, they simply trade an untouchable business elite for an untouchable political elite
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link