This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I don’t think other than legal issues age is a good qualifier of adulthood. The reason is pretty simple: what actually matures a human brain is that it’s forced to be responsible. You can find all sorts of examples in history of people the modern world would consider too young to be allowed to hold a job at McDonald’s. Alexander Hamilton was born in 1755, and by 1771, the age of 16 which is when our kids get baby’s first fast food job, our boy Alexander was mature enough to run a port for 5 months.
I can point to lots of my own family history where women were routinely getting married at 14 and having children by 15 or 16. It wasn’t all that rare for kids in the 19th century. It would not have been unusual for kids on farms to be doing things that we’d cringe at and probably charge people with neglect for allowing. Kids of 9 could tame calves, sheer sheep, help with livestock, and so on. Those kids were much more mature than their modern peers because much was expected of them at much younger ages. Our kids not only don’t do mature work, but increasingly aren’t really expected to help out around the house or do homework (at least in some districts).
I do think a universally accepted age of adulthood makes sense from a legal perspective. Having to individually decide on every milestone whether a person X years old can do it means a good deal of legal chaos. If you had a universal standard (say 18) then it’s no longer necessary to say “is he able to be treated as an adult?” If you’re 18, you can do everything any other adult can do.
More options
Context Copy link