This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I’ve heard legends from expats in Japan about the cultural expectation to be seen doing work at all times, rather than actually working hard.
Remarkable that bit about France’s 35 work day, seems like an interesting deep dive in of itself
And there's working hard vs. working productively. In a lot of Asian countries, I see people working hard, but in jobs that only make sense given the low cost of labour, e.g. lots of people standing about in the corridors to guide you to the right places at the ID card centre, lots people handing out fliers/holding up signs, or people standing outside a big building offering rooms in guesthouses to people passing in the street (the people advertising the rooms are unattractive middle-aged men, so I don't think that this is tacit prostitution).
These low-wage jobs reduce the productivity figures, but the people doing them work hard.
As a resident of Japan for 20 something years let me suggest： The guides guiding people in corridors or whatever are most likely subjected to hours of training for this job, training the likes of which might drive someone more used to, well, 'western' methods (I dislike the term and find it inaccurate but am typing with my thumbs) completely bonkers. They will have been trained in posture, what words to use, how often and how fast to speak these words, the physical delineation of their own realm of responsibility (how many meters squared is their own guide domain) as well as themselves knowing implicitly a ream of other unspoken behavioral unwritten rules that every Japanese worth hiring will know without being taught (this will all have been vetted in the hiring process.) As for the hapless malcontents holding up the poles with signs, these boards are not for pensions or hostels, but more likely either some sort of so-called water trade such as a handjob shop, massage of dubious skill, soapland, hotel health (in-house callgirls), so-called nobura or panchira salons, (that's your-server-has-no-bra or no-underpants) or some other perfectly wholesome venue which may or may not accept non-Japanese. Thus the booze-soaked dregs holding the signs： all they do is stand there, and, if prompted, guide you to your destination like a St. Bernard without the whiskey collar.
The cute girls will be advertising and passing out flyers for more standard fare such as girl's bars, maid cafes, or other less hands-on establishments.
The river runs wide and deep and if it's sexual and you can imagine it, and it's not punishable immediately by interpol, it's probably not much further than a back-alley away.
Just my two bits.
This description of the training is frustrating literally just to hear about haha
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
I worked in a small Chinese office that had a full time janitor. She was an older woman who mostly sat around and occasionally swept bit. There was certainly no need for a full time sweeper woman in that small office.
I suppose her wage is so low they don't care. Or a handout to someone's relative? Either way 0% productive. The floor wasn't actually that clean.
Yes, the low cost of labour in most of Asia is really stunning when you first encounter it.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link