site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of April 24, 2023

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

11
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

I mean, even if I don't outright starve, I'd rather not end up with little or no money to my name. India certainly can't support any meaningful welfare for its populace, and while standards are low, people aren't going to be happy with settling for meals and little else.

The West can certainly do better, which is why I'm moving my ass there pronto in the hopes I can wrangle citizenship.

Take everything here with a pinch of salt because I'm hardly an expert:

India has always been a secondary consideration for foreign companies looking to perform manufacturing, and the only reason several large companies have started shifting substantial minorities of their production here is because of rising wages in China coupled with their self-induced geopolitical uncertainty.

In order for a country to successfully weather the shock of rapid automation, from my perspective it either needs a great deal of money to buy-in, or large numbers of existing factories that can be easily automated. The former describes the US and most of the West, and the latter describes China. I wouldn't be surprised if both entities managed to make it through with only modest disruption.

On the other hand, India has neither. When other countries begin automating faster than we can with our limited funds, the export value of our goods will drop (but so will the import costs of foreign goods?), reducing the value of our money greatly. We'll have to compete for raw resources that others can afford to pay significantly more for, given their grossly increased productivity.

Add in the effects of unemployment of highly skilled sections of the work force, the kind of people who bring in large amounts of foreign money, such as remote workers, and automation will strike from the top and work down. It'll take time for the government to afford an UBI, and the costs of keeping an increasingly large unproductive chunk of the populace fed will be debilitating.

I'm doubtful of the country's governance capitalizing on the benefits in time to outweigh the massive disruption it'll cause, but once again, I'm no expert.