site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of June 19, 2023

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

10
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

This is starting with the wrong picture.

Per the Whistleblower testimony (which really needs to be read in detail) the non political appointees that routinely handle tax evasion cases wanted to go after Hunter on more serious tax evasion charges. This is true both of the agents investigating AND the staff level attorneys who review the agent’s recommendation. However, political appointees routinely blocked both their investigation and ultimately precluded them from charging Hunter on these more serious charges. Thus, it appears Hunter got a sweetheart deal before we even get to the charges here.

So it is sweetheart deal on top of sweetheart deal.

Edit—

It is important to note that in addition to the incremental tax issues, the government may have purposefully let other crimes (eg FARA) be statute limited. So you could’ve hit him with multiple tax fraud charges, FARA, gun charges, drug charges (which he evidently used as tender), maybe even bribery.

You could make a colorable case for all of that. Standard practice would be to charge him with all you can and then plea to something that would probably end up with 6-12 months. But here the government is alleged to slow weak charges so they’d fall off giving up leverage they would typically use.

The FARA allegations weren't anywhere near strong enough for the government to prosecute. Having business dealings with foreign interests isn't illegal; it's only when you take the next step of lobbying for these interests without disclosing it. This is where the theory fails, because the evidence of any actual lobbying is weak. The most I've seen from conservative outlets is that he made numerous trips to visit his father while he was involved in these foreign dealings, which, yeah, the guy visited his father. He probably would have visited him regardless of what business he was doing at the time. The defense attorney in that case is going to call every person on the White House visitor log who could have conceivably been in the room with Hunter and Joe on the days in question and they're all going to invariably deny that any lobbying on behalf of foreign interests took place; meanwhile, the prosecution won't be able to put forth a single witness who would be able to testify that it had. This isn't evidence, it's conjecture, and the prosecution would never be able to get this in front of a jury. I'm not familiar with any potential drug charges so maybe you could clue me in on those.

By the way, I’ve seen enough of Garland over the last two years that he needs to be impeached.

Could they have actually stopped it? Couldn’t Biden have just done a recess appointment?

The Democrats controlled the Senate so a recess appointment wouldn't have been necessary.

Republicans that voted to confirm him in the first place are all suspect, IMO. Even aside from his prior career, the Supreme Court situation was pretty obviously going to lead him having an axe to grind against political enemies, and he has not disappointed on that front. I can't even imagine Reagan or Bush following up on the Bork confirmation hearings by appointing him Attorney General, but if they did try it, there's zero chance that Democrats would have gone along with it.

That is a great point. It would be difficult for Garland to be impartial given that his dreams were dashed by the Republicans.

Then again, doesn't that show that he wasn't fit to be a Supreme Court justice? If he can't be impartial because he has an axe to grind here, how would he have managed on the bench trying cases leaning one way or the other politically?