site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of September 12, 2022

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

40
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

First time?

Two scattered thoughts I've been recently having somewhat related to your post.

  • Standards (and being correct) are for undergraduate students.

    Once you you have that magical paper that says 'PhD' on it, you can pretty much shit and piss all over the textbooks and still be lauded for being an "expert". "The War on drugs", "The War on terror", Covid, many such cases.

    I still remember carefully making sure that no variables were linearly dependent, the models were crossvalidated and the performance metrics were passed through a hypothesis test before passing in statistical modelling project during my undergrad; and then seeing the same professor just YOLO numbers in SPSS without a concern in the world if it made sense or not for her research work. But she has a PhD, everything her hands touch is magic, or so I've been told.

    I'm sure the further from academia and the further from the hard science you go, the more this is the case. Both the lack of expectation to be correct, and the amount of status you receive for having that paper.

  • This commentator you talked about is probably from the West.

    Ukraine is close to home. And the closer to home it, the more bad the bad guy is. Syria, Palestine, Mexico, Armenia, North Korea are all too abstract, too far away, they are not even real people. The most evil of all evils is he who threatens your income/status.

    It's always been politics. I'm surprised you are not jaded to this possibility.