This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
I have been following the misadventures of Justin Trudeau in International Diplomacy for quite some years and let me just say I view anything that comes out of his mouth with deep skepticism when it concerns other countries. Trudeau has a pattern of using the international stage for domestic politics. That in itself is not a bad thing but the sheer cluelessness that he conducts himself in the International arena is exasperating.
His previous India trip was a shinning example, his sole focus in the trip seemed like courting the Sikh vote in Canada rather than actual diplomacy. Over the top costumes(https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-43151115), dance numbers(https://youtube.com/watch?v=Vk5RMHFXfxw) and the latest tourist destinations(https://zeenews.india.com/india/golden-temple-to-iim-ahmedabad-here-is-visiting-canadian-pm-justin-trudeaus-full-itinerary-2081984.html). If that wasn't enough, the fact that the official Canadian delegation included a convicted Khalistani Terrorist who attempted murder of an Indian minister back in 1986(https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/khalistani-terrorist-jaspal-atwal-photographed-with-justin-trudeau-s-wife-at-mumbai-event-1175102-2018-02-22). You just can't make this shit up. So disastrous was this trip that even the most left leaning mainstream journalist, the kind of global elite who you would expect going gaga over the Liberal darling Trudeau, asserts that the whole thing was a cringefest(https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/global-opinions/wp/2018/02/22/trudeaus-india-trip-is-a-total-disaster-and-he-has-himself-to-blame/).
Even the recent G20 was a disaster for Trudeau. No bilateral meets with any country, in total 4 brief meetings with heads of state and not even a single photo-op for any announcement that concerned his agenda(climate change, Bio-Fuels Alliance). The meeting with Modi was the worst, as he apparently "scolded" the poor Canadian(https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/aircraft-glitch-delays-canada-pm-trudeaus-departure-india-2023-09-10/). It seems like the Canadian PM isn't taken seriously on an international stage, not just by India but other countries too and with good reason. He has a long history of engaging in diplomatic behavior that alienates him from other heads of state(https://edition.cnn.com/2018/06/10/politics/peter-navarro-justin-trudeau/index.html, https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/nov/16/xi-trudeau-canada-china-g20, https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/18/canada-loses-bid-un-security-council-seat-justin-trudeau, https://financialpost.com/news/economy/forget-donald-trump-justin-trudeau-is-now-the-biggest-obstacle-to-pacific-trade-deal, https://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-11-10/tpp-talks-stall-after-justin-trudeau-canada-fails-to-show-up/9140250).
Certainly I agree if India was behind such an action on foreign soil that is as serious as it gets, but claiming India is picking a fight with Canada is an overstatement. Trudeau has long courted the Khalistani vote and that alone makes the Indian government nervous. Adding more fuel to it he even allowed a referendum to be conducted in Canada on a demand for separate state in India, allowed a float glorifying the assassination of former Prime Minister Indira Gandhi and lets them fund the Khalistani activities in India through Canada.
Now I am certainly biased in my views against Khalistan as an Indian Citizen, but my point is that India has very legitimate position in current diplomatic tensions.
Harper used to get a lot of criticism for damaging Canada's international reputation, but Trudeau seems to be doing at least as bad a job. There was also the incident a few years ago where he criticized Saudi Arabia and they banned their citizens from travelling to Canada.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link