This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
First time?
I get what you're motioning around, but that's what it felt like for a lot of other people a lot earlier. Any opposition to the Affordable Care Act deriving solely from the President's race was a mainstay from 2009-2012. The only possible motivation for a specific anti-gay policy being thoughtless homophobia is gold-standard SCOTUS law, recognized at three different major cases, and with far broader academic and institutional support. Gun owners as wanting more Trayvon Martin shootings was absolutely a thing.
Journolist was revealed in 2010: it wasn't just that it happened, but even the why and how was common knowledge for a set.
It matters that a bunch of people suddenly got to see it first-hand! But it's why I'm skeptical of it as a starting point.
See that's just US politics to me, but I see your point, maybe it's better described as an escalation. A dramatic escalation. Gamergate marked a change to me not just as an event, but because it coincided with complete US control over the Western cultural hegemon through social media. It went pro and spread from politics to everything, and from the US to everywhere (in the west). I have been politically aware since 2004/5, but trying to get Australians to talk about US politics back then was like pulling teeth. Even during Obama's election people mostly just saw it as a curio - he's going for the record for the fastest assassinated US president they'd laugh and then change the subject. 2012 wasn't much different - Obama was going to win or else Americans are all bigots so what's there to talk about? But after gamergate started, people started paying attention to US politics too. Suddenly every politically aware Australian I knew wanted to talk to me about the midterms! I didn't even want to talk about the midterms. But a lot of Australians and Europeans became very interested in US politics from then on, and I had to start explaining that I was an expat so other Americans wouldn't tell me to shove my opinions up my ass.
So the way I see gamergate is as the engagement where the scolds tried out their new weapon to great success - mind killing themselves in the face of empathising with the enemy. And it hit my shitty little corner of the internet - tech and gaming journalism - just before spreading everywhere. I wrote neutral stories on many of those previous events, and the only one I got push back on was Eich, because Eich himself supported his ousting. I'm sure there was bitching and sniping behind my back about what a chud I was, but it stayed behind my back. Then when gamergate came around, merely asking for a link to gjoni's post had people threatening to blacklist me. The ideology had become so totalising that not even enthusiast press could escape it - and enthusiast press has always been one of the most trivial things in existence.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link