site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of September 26, 2022

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

26
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

I saw a shitpost the other day on 4chan in which some anon argued his litmus test for whether he was speaking to a stupid person or not.

Essentially, if he makes a statement like "Asians are shorter on average than Caucasians" and someone rebuts "but I know an Asian guy who's 6'2"", then he knows he's dealing with an unintelligent person.

It's staggering the number of people I've met - people with Master's degrees, people who've succeeded in their chosen fields - who seem completely unable to grasp the concept of averages and distributions. There are so many people who hear a statement like "on average, women have lower sex drives than men" and interpret it to mean "literally every woman is less horny than literally every man, there is not a single woman anywhere in the world who is hornier than a man". Like, the idea of outliers is built into the concept of a "distribution". The entire concept of an average presupposes that there are members within that set which fall above and below it.

It's incredible to me how so many people think that "but I know an Asian guy who's 6'2"" or "I'm a woman and my sex drive is way higher than my boyfriend's" is some kind of "gotcha".

There was no source for it I was able to hunt down, but I'd really love to find out that the half-recollected factoid about Piraha children being able to learn the arithmetic their parents never could (that I read here recently) turns out to really be true. The common first-world adult inability to grok distributions reminds me of nothing more than the typical Piraha adult inability to work with numbers, and yet if there's hope for their future generations then maybe there's hope for ours too.