yofuckreddit
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User ID: 646
yofuckreddit
2d ago
For every single caveat you could line up to frame this as "dishonest," you have lined up there's an equal and opposite modifier the other way. These are people who aren't citizens, many without IDs or stable places to live, and they still were somehow indicted in our crappy criminal justice system?
Most reasonable people would agree that traffic and weed are a totally different deal. 66% is fucking enormous - it's higher than black males.
yofuckreddit
2d ago
If your point is that the median voter is a spinless fool devoid of coherent political philosophy, who simultaneously wants more gibmes and lower taxes, who reads headlines and tweets to form every opinion.... then yeah, I agree with you.
I even think that, as a pragmatic measure, Trump backing down on this gives him enough time to save face before the next election, maybe even midterms!
they don't want to see a bunch of scary violence
It should be more normal to be averse to violence than it is today. But it's sick that a 30-second clip of gunfire is what's being force-fed down the gullets of the ducks being fattened for slaughter, not the endless hours of shitty rioters blanketing Minnesota.
yofuckreddit
2d ago
/r/bicycling has something like 55k upvotes where the last actual bicycling-related post topped out at 13k. I know Trump is great, but this is just a shallow copy of George Floyd virtue-jerking frenzy (although TBF a superior martyr).
In talking to blue people IRL, my sampling so far is:
- Men: 50% believe no deportations should happen, 50% believe that it should be done more effectively and less violently.
- Women: 90% believe no deportations should happen.
Quite frankly, if we were all on the same page about doing deportations quickly, we wouldn't even have much of an argument.
I'm seeing more framing like you're presenting here. Transparently, I don't believe it. People don't show up to these protests to prove they aren't intimidated. None of the people protesting are going to be stopped by ICE's detention or deportation. The most charitable way I can frame it is that they view illegal immigrants as the people working at their favorite mexican place or mowing their yard and think it makes their cause righteous.
In reality, it's just garden-variety TDS. The anti-ICE riots are happening exclusively in blue cities where a critical mass of people and opinions are relishing the opportunity to get in a fight with agents of the state they view as extensions of Trump himself. But of course, they'd riot if he offered free ice cream.
I mean, look at this framing from NPR: "A Third of people arrested by ICE have no Criminal record". Are we for real here? ICE's track record so far is such that even wildly dishonest, leftist institutions admit that 66% of them are criminals, and now we're talking about why we need to stop that activity?
The new argument ("We just want smart deportations") is because moderates do grok how insane it is to be using cars as weapons, to wrestle with cops while carrying a gun, and then to pretend like you're a victim. I've only heard it in the past 3 days. And I say this while believing that Saturday's shoot was not a good one - it's a huge bummer that he got killed, and it looks like a mistake more than anything else.
Insane take. Insane. He was wrestling the whole fucking time man. Jesus.
Let's say the act of being arrested is 1 standard unit of violence. Being shot by the police is... Some higher number. 10?
The act of facilitating a useful permit regime is .01. It's useful to round to zero in polite everyday conversation, I do it all the time. In this discussion, this is what you're saying by suggesting it's not required.
If that's true and it had truly zero utility, you wouldn't even bother showing up to the police station. But if we are being precise then .01 <> 0.
Aside: there's a direct example of this in America. RealID - just upgrading the legitimacy of identification - was passed in 2005. It was supposedly completely implemented by 2024, and is supposedly being enforced by airports as of last year. (They're not, actually, but most people believe it now)
The secret is that they're not, and waitlists to get DMV appointments to upgrade are still years long in some jurisdictions. The whole country essentially didn't bother doing it, until the threat/utility became more real.
yofuckreddit
3d ago
There is a significant difference between standing guard outside a car dealership (Rittenhouse) and the tactics of anti-ICE protestors.
The latter is being actively physically violent, using cars as weapons, and moving as close to the line that justified lethal force as possible.
Lemmings on a cliff, pushing each other forward. The ones who survive get smoky, exciting Instagram reels and likes on blue sky. The ones who fall off are catching bullets. It's an acceptable cost to the group.
yofuckreddit
3d ago
It's fair to call out that the right was not disciplined on J6.
That's one example compared to dozens (hundreds?) of instances on the left over the past decade.
yofuckreddit
4d ago
I don't see what's hard to understand about this.
By the state enforcing consequences - of violence - for not having a permit or not having an ID card, it granting people these things is still a violent act.
Of course it feels different in the moment. Or maybe "It's just a piece of paper". But it's all control at the barrel of a gun, even if it's a permit/ID regime I think is practically useful or even required in a modern western nation.
My Libertarian bones ache to agree with you. I even think that ICE doing these manual, piecemeal raids is less effective than blanket enforcement at Farms, meat processors, and landscaping companies.
But once again reality rears its head: You cannot simultaneously prioritize criminals for deportation (which the Admin is clearly doing, given 2/3 of the targets are criminals) and the, frankly, decent people working in industry. This demand from the left makes me want to fucking scream it's so dissonant.
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