This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
A strawman? That passage was describing half of one of the most common abusive tactics in existence. You pump someone up with over the top displays of love and affection, and then you make them feel worthless for minor errors. This way you can convince them that they are worthless and only redeemed by your love. It is stock in trade for some leftist communities and organisations, because those leftist communities and organisations have been taken over by abusers. There have been several examples already in this thread, and if I remember correctly there were more in the original thread. This is no strawman, and it's not that leftist spaces just suck - they weren't always like this! But they have been co-opted by bad actors relying on the concept of no enemies to the left.
Personally I think it is a natural consequence of the leftist claim that domestic violence is a woman centric problem requiring a feminist lens to resolve, excusing abusers if they don't fit the patriarchal model, which allows them to flourish and inspires others to assume their tactics to get ahead.
Now that you can call a strawman, because I can't prove it, I don't think anyone will be able to for at least another decade - anyone who even breathes in that direction in the past decade gets run out of the industry like they were caught fucking chickens. But if you get an advocate drunk and ask them about it, you'll hear horror stories that will make Miranda Priestly look like Leslie Knope.
Yeah, I’m calling that passage a strawman. The whole OP was theorizing how leftist communities—not just extremist ones—were “quasi-lovebombing.” That’s a call to view seemingly positive interactions as the sort of abusive tactics you describe. It was also paired with lamentations about how right-wingers were too good at facing reality:
The corollary is left unstated.
I think that broad brush demands better evidence than “one time I watched a contrapoints video and it felt parasocial,” which was all the OP offered.
For what it’s worth, your interpretation of feminist frameworks as exploitable doesn’t scan as a strawman at all. It might be taboo, but that’s not because it’s implausible.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link