This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
It's been answered. After the race riots of the '60 and early '70s, we had the racial detente of the 70s and 80s, but then things got worse; we had the Rodney King Riots and a generation later the more-widespread Floyd riots.
Not really, no. Nations rise and fall within that time. For all the US gets shit for "200 years is a long time", such staid European nations as Germany and Italy are only a century and a half old, and aren't even really continuous through that time.
And her granddaughter's (or great-granddaughters) peers not only believe that, they have scientific studies PROVING that white physicians are killing black babies.
Don't confuse what white progressives might say and what black people believe. They may be allied politically but they are very different groups. As far as I can tell approximately zero of the younger group believe that. In fact they don't believe a white doctor tried to kill their great-grandmothers/great aunts baby at all, last time it came up they expressed a great deal of skepticism, because they can't even conceive of experiencing that level of personal racism.
What is commonish is the idea that white doctors may still be slightly biased in the ways they treat and diagnose black mothers (particularly around pain management) but that is very different from the belief that they are outright murdering black children for racist reasons. And they may be right about that, when my wife was in hospital, I had to intervene several times because they were not taking her levels of pain seriously at all.
That's an improvement! From outright murderous racist doctors to doctors can be biased in how they deliver treatment is a downgrade in levels of racial resentment/belief! Time is on your side here.
Heck even in the Floyd riots many (most?) of the rioters were in fact not black. If we look at Rittenhouse, of the three people who he shot, none of them were black. If you watch the videos of that night most of the people we see are white. Michael Reinoehl and Aaron Danielson, both white. More people were killed in the LA riots than the Floyd riots, even though one was much more widespread.
Whatever people say, the facts on the ground do not appear to validate the idea that things are worse. Interracial marriage rates are increasing, which is a key measure of integration. "Since 1980, the share who married someone of a different race or ethnicity has more than tripled from 5% to 18%"
As for timescales. Look I'm Northern Irish, we're still beefing about King William vs King James in 1690 and whether the Brits can be blamed for the Norman invasion of Ireland in the 1170's. Give it another couple hundred years and see where you are. You're young yet.
Which does not mean that a large number of black people (or at least specifically black descendants of slaves) do not in fact still resent white people, for slavery, for Jim Crow, for various hurts both real and imagined.
The one he missed (Jump Kick Man) was black. Kenosha is about 10% black.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link