site banner
bolido_sentimental  1yr ago (text post)   3349 thread views

Small-Scale Question Sunday for December 25, 2022

Merry Christmas, everyone!

4
Top Bottom Old Controversial Comments
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

Does the pronoun "you" in English playing quadruple role (2nd person singular subject, 2nd person singular object, 2nd person plural subject, 2nd person object) harm communication, or would it be better if in English the distinction between subject and object in pronouns wouldn't exist, given that in English nouns aren't declined according to subject/object but only by number (singular/plural) and possessive? But even then the question if creating a distinction between 2nd person singular and plural, as there is in 1st person (I/we) and in 3rd (he/they), is beneficial.

I've always thought that English could do with a second person plural, like 'vous' in French. Being able to distinguish between talking to a group and an individual in a group setting is very helpful.

Of course, language being what it is, English speakers have basically created alternatives out of necessity (y'all, youse, you guys etc). Give it a few hundred years and I'm sure we'll be using them as words in their own right.

In addition to its traditional usage by Southern Americans as well as black Americans from all over the country, "y'all" has recently (within the past 10 years) come into favor among upper-middle-class Americans who wouldn't have been caught dead using it a generation ago. These are most often woke young women who ostensibly prefer "y'all" over the previous preferred alternative, "you guys", because "you guys" is not gender-inclusive (no one seemed to care about that before). I think another contributing factor is getting the chance to sound more black - they feel uncomfortable with using the n-word while singing rap lyrics, so this is the next best thing.

What is this place?

This website is a place for people who want to move past shady thinking and test their ideas in a court of people who don't all share the same biases. Our goal is to optimize for light, not heat; this is a group effort, and all commentators are asked to do their part.

The weekly Culture War threads host the most controversial topics and are the most visible aspect of The Motte. However, many other topics are appropriate here. We encourage people to post anything related to science, politics, or philosophy; if in doubt, post!

Check out The Vault for an archive of old quality posts. You are encouraged to crosspost these elsewhere.


Why are you called The Motte?

A motte is a stone keep on a raised earthwork common in early medieval fortifications. More pertinently, it's an element in a rhetorical move called a "Motte-and-Bailey", originally identified by philosopher Nicholas Shackel. It describes the tendency in discourse for people to move from a controversial but high value claim to a defensible but less exciting one upon any resistance to the former. He likens this to the medieval fortification, where a desirable land (the bailey) is abandoned when in danger for the more easily defended motte. In Shackel's words, "The Motte represents the defensible but undesired propositions to which one retreats when hard pressed."

On The Motte, always attempt to remain inside your defensible territory, even if you are not being pressed.


New post guidelines

If you're posting something that isn't related to the culture war, we encourage you to post a thread for it. A submission statement is highly appreciated, but isn't necessary for text posts or links to largely-text posts such as blogs or news articles; if we're unsure of the value of your post, we might remove it until you add a submission statement. A submission statement is required for non-text sources (videos, podcasts, images).

Culture war posts go in the culture war thread; all links must either include a submission statement or significant commentary. Bare links without those will be removed.

If in doubt, please post it!


Rules


Recommended Posts And Communities

Recommended Realtime Chats