This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Wait, how do you think they got there?
The current refugee regime dates back to Carter’s presidency. It integrated the efforts of existing VOLAGs, which are probably the NGOs you have in mind. Not exactly a new invention.
Minnesota has a bunch of NGOs, including some of the VOLAGs. Global Refuge is Lutheran and USCCB Catholic; both denominations are well-represented in the state. Historically, they’ve literally volunteered to take refugees. I believe they’re ending up in the Twin Cities more than individual towns, but I don’t have a source for that.
Somalis specifically started fleeing their civil war in the early 90s. Omar got here in ‘95. There was definitely a surge around 2012 coinciding with a new push in the war; that accounts for about 6,000 Minnesotans. More stats here.
Point is, the Somali population mostly pre-dates Obama and definitely pre-dates Biden. There’s been plenty of support from native Minnesota institutions, largely downstream of a strong Christian presence. The national involvement was hashed out before there was even a Somalian civil war, and continued for decades without today’s wailing and gnashing of teeth. I don’t think you can write it off as nonconsensual Federal airdrops to random towns.
I'm not saying they were hiding it.
The process was definitely transparent in that they will straight up tell you how many they brought in.
I just note that somehow, the Sub-Saharan Immigrant population was about 1.3 million in 2010, and is listed at 2.5 million in 2024, so almost doubling.
Do I have to point out who the sitting Presidents were during the majority of that time period?
And the included map shows that a huge number of them were indeed dropped off in Minnesota, to the point they're around 3% of the population in the Minneapolis area.
The part that hasn't become so transparent until lately is exactly how much aid these folks were receiving, and, likewise, how much fraud and crime many were involved in.
If the Minnesotans start to disapprove of this situation, what's their recourse, precisely?
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link