This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
From The (In)Effective Altruism Diaries: The Case Of Centi-Millionaire Marxist
You possibly already heard about James Cox Chambers Jr.
He is character that would be laughed at and rejected outright in any creative writing class as crude, primitive and unfunny caricature of leftist written by hate filled right wing bigot.
And he is real.
Descendant of long line of distinguished WASP's. As close to hereditary aristocracy as you can get in today's world. Wikipedia article of your own is now what noble title used to be.
(Yes, pure Anglo Saxon ancestry, no documented Jewish ancestors, if you are looking for this thing, you can be disappointed)
Who is, since early age, dedicated Marxist devoted to fighting for revolutionary cause.
Now, his means are not negligible. 250M hard bourgeois bucks is nothing to sneer at.
Distinguished revolutionaries in the past used cash with great efficiency as weapon to hasten the demise of capitalist world.
Comrade Cox-Chambers is not one of them. In 30 years of struggle, he really achieved nothing much worth showing. The Berkshire Communists, The Berkshire People's Gym, The Butterfly Collective etc. are not up there with The Sealed Train.
Neither are Dakota pipeline protests or Cop City protests.
At least the Georgia commune members had some fun, while it lasted.
This shows once again weakness of premise of effective altruism and 80,000 hours movement that money alone is sufficient to change the world. It is not specific to communism/leftism, many cases of right wing money wasted in even more pointless way.
Now, if you are inclined to laugh at the outgroup, show how would you do better. Your homework, your hypothetical scenario for today is:
You are given 250M in USD.
Your mission is to promote COMMUNISM. Not some petty bourgeois hippy nonsense, but real, scientific and authentic Marx-Lenin-Stalin thought.
How would you get the greatest bang for the buck, how would you most efficiently use capitalist cash to bring forward glorious communist future?
Show your work. Best entries will be rewarded with eternal revolutionary glory and virtual Stalin Golden Prize.
The very simple answer is to claim that all Lenin-Stalin thought is actually deviation from authentic Marxist Stage Theory. To develop a Plain Reading of Marx that advocates for capitalism as a matter of development and productive capacity as a further step towards actual Marxism.
You take credit for every advance in GDP. Whenever a country implements market reforms and grows that's Actual Communism. When a country flounders that's Deviationism. Cheap electricity? A sign of future Marxism. Rising house prices? State deviationism away from Marxist overabundance. Ozempic is Marxist. High Speed Rail is Marxist. Forests are Marxist. Breathable air is Marxist. You take credit for all the gains of capitalism but disavow any ownership local tensions. You conflate development with historical destiny, you disavow all failures as tragedies of our age will will, eventually, at an unspecified time, be overcome once The Next Stage of History comes into being.
You buy the Vanguard Total Stock Market Index to keep your 250 million alive. There is no contradiction. You use some of your proceeds to pay people to write books, science fiction, and fan fiction. You live a quite life. Your goal isn't to build a gym and show how change is possible now. Your goal is to entice people with a possibility of the future. Your friends call you Fabius. No one gets the reference. Nothing should ever be available now. Communism will arrive "Like a thief in the Night" and "No one knows the time or hour". The uneducated will find these phrases self-evident, although they can't quite place why they find them intuitive.
Yours is not a Vanguard Party of action, but a vanguard party of thought. Whose goal isn't to instantiate communism, that of course is a historical necessity driven by new Modes of Production whose being isn't conceivable yet but which the capitalist mode must eventually create, but rather your goal is to keep alive the communist dream among some educated few because it is beautiful. You turn theory away from the drab of Actually Having to Do Something. Instead your society becomes a society of dreamers, a society of romantics who feel self assured in their inevitable destiny and who want to spread the word not out of revolution against capitalism, but out of love of the vision. You avoid all communist iconography. You avoid the Red, the hammer and sickle, the Socialist Realism. Those are deviations and you won't be tarnished by them. You indulge in a little identification by calling yourself "historically Parisian in outlook". No one gets the reference.
You spend half of the returns from your Index position on your project. the other half remains with you personally. You die 30 years later a Billionare.
The Real Communism is when the workers collectively own the means of production... In their 401K or pension plans. Wait, it already looks like that, even if the asset distribution isn't exactly equal (ask not why Party Members get nicer apartments and Ladas, comrade!).
Imagine a world where Marxists ardently claim that Index investing is the next "Stage of Investment" that "Rearranges the Mode of Investment", and which "Structures Capital in its latest stage, making new Social Relations possible" (investing in the first place)
Meanwhile the culture war continues and anti-marxists claim index funds prevent entrepreneurial spirit in individuals and therefor must be avoided at all costs.
I've heard both these arguments made by niche liberal and market socialist figures, so it is this world.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link