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naraburns  nihil supernum  1yr ago (text post)   32435 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of February 13, 2023

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The excess deaths are probably caused by the after effects of Corona. Myocarditis and other heart issues are moderately common in people who didn't even have severe cases. Most of the people who have these issues probably don't know they have them. Then there are the severe cases, of which there were a lot, where people were stuck on ventilators and likely had all sorts of complications. Those people often aren't long for this world. There's also a case to be made that isolation caused by the pandemic has increased all cause mortality, bit that's pretty foggy and may not be true. It's also possible that the data is just off.

If the vaccines caused noticeable health risks it would be absurdly easy to see a correlation. Vaccination=higher mortality. That correlation isn't there. Also, hiding a health issue caused by a drug is so outside of the FDAs historical behavioral pattern that it's really ridiculous to lean into some conspiratorial coverup. Remember, when 2 J&J vaccine patients had heart issues out if millions (a rate which is far less than the rate in the random population) the FDA pulled the vaccine immediately. Yet they're covering up mass sickness from other vaccines?

This is one of those conspiracies that's really hard not to be condescending about because it's just so thinly supported.

What would you say if a positive correlation seemed to exist between number of vaccine doses and likelihood of contracting Omicron?

See page 21

That double blind trial data is a lot better and very clear that this isn't the case. We don't have to do guessing games with outside factors (such as risk taking when you know you're vaccinated), so why would we?

What double-blind trial is studying booster performance against Omicron?

Anyways, you said "correlation" -- one seems to exist, what now?

They have trials for all the boosters.

Double blind ones looking at probability of infection as compared with zero, one, two (or more) previous doses?

I don't think they do, please link.

Being boosters, they are inherently looking at the effect vs the previous dose.

Its a bit ridiculous to ask for something so easily accessible on google as moderna vaccine trials.

It's a bit ridiculous to try changing the subject when called on your own bullshit asked for data to back up your unsourced assertions.

You said that if vaccines caused increased chance of health problems, there would be an obvious correlation -- and asserted that it wasn't there.

When I provided a large survey (in a young and pretty homogeneous population, btw) by a bunch of infectious disease PhDs showing... an obvious correlation between # of vaccine doses and likelihood of contracting coronavirus, instead of re-evaluating your position, you bring up different studies studying different things. (most notably conducted ~2 years ago, against a significantly different variant than the one currently circulating)

Have you considered that your position in this matter may not depend on what's true at all?

Have you considered that your position in this matter may not depend on what's true at all?

I think you should consider that your worldview is contrarian to try to make yourself feel that you're smarter than others but actually tarnishes your ability to view these things objectively. We're also approaching a tertiary problem not very related to covid here--there's enough information on the internet that you can find some information somewhere to support any contrarian claim. As a contrarian I fall into this trap sometimes, but the data on this subject is quite clear. Just to be nice, I typed in "Covid vaccine safety" into google, and copy and pasted the first link. I shouldn't really need to copy and paste links from simple google searches. If this was more niche not easily accessible data you might have a point.

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/research/publications/index.html

There are only a gajillion studies in there, some of them the original double blind IIRC, and most concerns related to the vaccine have multiple studies posted under them.

There are outlier events for lots of vaccines, usually allergic/autoimmune reactions, but there is pretty clear that, no, there is not a higher mortality rate among the vaccinated. There is the opposite.

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