site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of June 1, 2026

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

4
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

Sexual Objectification

There is something that bothers me about watching progressive/feminist content on youtube, especially regarding the topic of objectification, and its particularly emphasized in this video, as follows:

So if something doesn't serve a purpose (nudity and sex scenes), it's clear the only purpose it serves is to scratch an itch of the artists. This is something called Chekhov's gun, which is a storytelling principle that says if a gun is shown on screen, it must be fired later in the story. And if it isn't, the filmmaker made a promise to the audience that they didn't keep.

It's absolutely the same with female nudity and violence on screen. If it serves no artistic purpose, then the sole purpose becomes the objectification of women and the normalization of violence.

You know, like that scene where Cassie (Refering to the show euphoria) turns into a giant. Absolutely unnecessary. And it's completely inconsistent with the show's genre, which has no magical elements up until that point. We already got the point that Cassie is defined by her breasts from the 15-minute montage leading up to that scene and the other 200 shots of her naked throughout the show. Like, we got it, right? We got that point.

We actually didn't need you to bend the genre of the show in order to show her boobs in a giant form. In general, the amount of unnecessary nudity and the way that the camera lingers on women's naked bodies, or bodies in general, is beyond what is needed to make the point that they're in a lurid, exploitative industry.

To rehash for someone not familiar, objectification is defined as: the act of treating a person as an object, a commodity, or a tool, rather than as a whole human being with their own agency, feelings, and rights. The most common form, (sexual) occurs when a person is reduced to a mere object of sexual desire. It often involves judging someone solely based on their physical attributes or breaking their body into separate, "consumable" parts (e.g., focusing only on legs or a torso).

The main issue here is that this idea, at least on the surface is that it seems to be fundamentally in conflict with the the sexual revolution and sex positivity of many previous & current progressive movements. Pornography, prostitution, and strip clubs all fit the objectification bill quite neatly, and the data seems to support the authors argument that "sexual objectification" leads to or plays some role in many of these harms:

Sex workers are a vulnerable group of individuals that experience sexual violence on the job, but it is difficult and limiting for workers to report their assault (Sex Workers Project, 2020). Sex workers are adults who receive money or goods in exchange for consensual sexual acts. According to research, globally, sex workers have a 45% to 75% chance of experiencing sexual violence on the job (Sex Workers Project, 2020).

I struggle to see how these individuals may square this perspective that sex work is valid, despite fitting the bill of objectification. Perhaps there is something I'm missing?

I struggle to see how these individuals may square this perspective that sex work is valid, despite fitting the bill of objectification. Perhaps there is something I'm missing?

I suspect this stems from a pre-existing contradiction in certain predatory strains of male sexuality/sexual behavior (note, emphatically not all all male sexuality! Normal gents who want to honorably date a nice smart girl, enjoy common interests and glance appreciatively at her ass from time to time, not describing you).

The contradiction: Among certain predators, on the one hand, you get the objectifying impulse that says "this girl only exists in relation to my sexual desire, the only important parts of her are the physical parts that make me hard or that I envision fucking."

On the other hand, you get the aggression and post-coital disgust impulse that underlies the whole body-count discourse: My erection is so meaningful that being able to fuck this collection of holes and bulges is the most important thing in the world. But once I cum, these parts are disgusting, destroyed, degraded, and the body/mind attached to them should be cast out of my sight.

In its most extreme cases, this is the standard serial-killer's repeated torture, rape then kill/discard scenario. For prostitution and porn, it comes out in aggressive disgust/rejection impulses to prostitutes and female performers. Today, that's the folks who thought Riley Reid shouldn't be able to get married to a cool, successful athlete because all the penis contact made her gross. Historically, it was the consensus that once a woman had been traumatized or desperate enough to have sex with men for money, or let a man take pictures of her body for cash, she (but NOT he) should be expelled from normal society and untouchable by anyone but criminals, with no valid life course but exile, increasing degradation, then suicide.

So some feminists respond by saying, OK, objectification is bad, but even worse is the destructive disgust impulse after. So emphasize that women retain human value and agency even after being fucked over, establish that they are reasoning people who responded to the circumstances they were in, and that could include conditional compliance with predators wanting to reduce them to a collection of body parts.

And some feminists respond to the upstream objectification impulse by saying, nope, we need a system where women aren't reduced to a collection of body parts, period.

It's basically the Danegeld or Poland 1939 question: compromise with clear terms, or open resistance? But those are two different strategic approaches to a common problem, not really internally contradictory.

I feel like your depiction of historical prostitution is a little exaggerated. Obviously there's a whole category of high ranking courtesans who could do pretty well even without being actual wives of their clients. But even regular prostitutes were sometimes able to retire into respectability.