This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Neural Networks Are Already Clean
Nick Cammarata (Goodfire AI; formerly of OpenAI) claims to have discovered that earlier foundational research on the semantic structure of neural networks (especially "superposition") were wrong, and they actually (and necessarily!) work pretty much the naive way everybody used to expect them to: particular neurons mean particular, ultimately interpretable things.
My (admittedly jumpy and currently highly-sperged) gut instinct is that this may be one of the most significant findings in history or at least since AIAYN.
Very interesting, if true. And an example of recursive improvement of AI along a totally different axis, since the interpretability pipeline uses agent driven investigations.
If it disproves the ‘AI is a shoggoth’ theory it will be massively consequential.
More options
Context Copy link
Big if true. I've only skimmed the first section so far, but my heuristics for skepticism go in this order:
I'm probably cranky and judgy, but with the amount of slop research that has come out in the past couple years, incredibly sensationalist claims like "polysemanticity was just an mistake" from a researcher who's bio is "I like doing LSD and writing philosophy blogs inbetween startup gigs" leaves me very cynical. But let me dig through it and update when i get done.
More options
Context Copy link
This is a cheap shot, but I feel like if 'AIAYN' were one of the most significant findings in history, I would not have had to google it to understand what you're talking about.
The most significant finding since 2017, maybe? I guess? But there's a pretty significant gap between 'all of history' and 'the last nine years'.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link