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naraburns  nihil supernum  1yr ago (text post)   3036 thread views

Friday Fun Thread for March 24, 2023

Be advised: this thread is not for serious in-depth discussion of weighty topics (we have a link for that), this thread is not for anything Culture War related. This thread is for Fun. You got jokes? Share 'em. You got silly questions? Ask 'em.

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Is it just me, or is verbal debate as a method of determining which side is correct extremely over rated? It's fine as a spectator sport, but it's only a couple steps ahead of honor duels with blades to determine who's actually right. You can't check your opponent's source mid-debate if you're unfamiliar with it but suspicious it's of dubious quality, if you have a slip of a tongue or misphrase something you look like an idiot even if you're actually correct, the time limits are often too short to properly explain your point. In some debates, like ones in presidential elections, people will often interrupt and speak over each other.

The much more obvious alternative is to have written debates, like on a forum similar to this one, where you go back and forth replying with your opponent and having time to properly research and think out your arguments. I know the reason this isn't done is because it's much less entertaining, and that a lot of people probably don't have the patience to read 4000 dull words about economics or racism or whatever, but I'm still kind of surprised it's not like common knowledge that it'd be a better alternative.

No, it’s totally a spectator sport. And it’s used as such—for convincing viewers that one position is reasonable. Or that one team has the better charisma. It’s about demonstrating that real, functional people will stake their status on a position.

The same is true for an exchange of effortposts. Actually changing your interlocutor’s mind is rare, and usually depends on axioms. I’m not going to convince a theist that God doesn’t exist. But the format is valuable because other readers get a sense for whether those axioms fit them. It’s humanizing. To reach theists (or atheists or leftists or reactionaries or…), they need to know that their opponents are real and earnest. Long form posting is one way to signal that. So are public debates.

I'm talking about stuff like presidential debates before an election, or when internet political commentators debate each other on Twitch. Their goal isn't to change each other's minds, or to humanize themselves for viewers. It's to show viewers that the other side is wrong and that they are correct, ostensibly. But verbal debate fails at that. If their self-proclaimed goal was actually just for the debaters to have an opportunity to show off how earnest they are, I wouldn't have an issue with it, but I don't debates ever call that their goal.

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