site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of July 31, 2023

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

12
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

But it's not essential (when was the last time Bush did any ranching on his ranch?).

This is not unusual for Texas elites; a ranch is more like a villa or a high end dacha than an actual working ranch and this is well understood by everyone reporting on it and most of the people who hear the reporting. Bush voters did not think his ranch produced anything, except maybe some game meat.

They purchased it shortly before he ran for president and moved to a house near Dallas after his presidency. The ranch aerved an important function when he was president, sure, so it's not as though it was only a campaign prop. But the conceit of Bush owning a ranch as part of his folksy, Texan heritage was a deliberate image he projected that was largely discarded once he didn't have a need for it. Now in his post-presidency he's much more free to pursue his interests independent of public image -- which turns out to be painting. (This was a late surprise to himself too I think, but definitely not in harmony with the image his campaign projected. Incidentally, and I love art so I don't want to look down on Bush for trying his hand at it -- I have seen his paintings, they had a large collection on display at the Truman Library in Missouri, and they might be the worst portraits I have ever seen in a professional gallery. They enter the uncanny valley, they're genuinely bad, several made me laugh out loud, and to the point that I actually felt a little embarrassed.)

Churchill liked painting as well, and I consider some of his watercolours the worst landscapes I've seen, so conservative politicans and amateur art don't seem that uncommon.

Grant, Eisenhower, Carter, and Bush all took up painting. I suppose when you've served as the most famous and powerful man in the world, art is a respite and source of solitude that has become unusually hard to come by.

Hmph, looks like the left was right all along. (You know who else loved to paint but was really bad at it?...)

Was going to post this, but felt too low effort. Anyway I have to disagree, Hitlers painting of Neuschwanstein to appears to posses beauty, albeit one even the masses are capable of appreciating.

The true similarity between Adolf and George is inability to paint people.

Ah, having seen that I can now see why the director of the school of art recommended him to study architecture.

Was going to post this, but felt too low effort

Ouch!

Hitlers painting of Neuschwanstein to appears to posses beauty, albeit one able to be appreciated by the masses.

It appears to, but when you look at it too much it's like every feature is drawn from a slightly different perspective -- I find it jarring, which is not the feeling you want to get from mass-appeal-beauty-type painting.

Ironically I think Hitler could have been quite successful as a cubist/modernist or something -- but of course he hated that stuff.

I confess I haven't seen Bush's art so can't comment -- is Hunter Biden any good?

It appears to, but when you look at it too much it's like every feature is drawn from a slightly different perspective

A photo was taken from a nearby point and I can't see where mistakes are.

I confess I haven't seen Bush's art so can't comment

Googling the art of George Bush shows that he only paints portraits and I stand by my statement that he sucks at it. His painting of Putin is surpassed by works high schoolers.

-- is Hunter Biden any good?

More of a contemporary artist, but despite my distate for his style still better than oeuvre of Bush.

A photo was taken from a nearby point and I can't see where mistakes are.

Look at the windows and buttresses -- none of them are individually wrong, but it's like they are all drawn from a slightly different viewpoint.

Unsettling.

If Hitler had moved to Paris after the war we would have one more interesting modern artist and one less homicidal dictator.

Googling the art of George Bush shows that he only paints portraits and I stand by my statement that he sucks at it. His painting of Putin is surpassed by works high schoolers.

OK, that is pretty bad, lol.

ED: Damn I can't believe I missed the low effort joke --

Clearly Bush is EVEN WORSE than Hitler!

More of a contemporary artist, but despite my distate for his style still better than oeuvre of Bush.

Huh, interesting -- I like his art-hoe look too!

Look at the windows and buttresses -- none of them are individually wrong, but it's like they are all drawn from a slightly different viewpoint.

Unsettling.

I thought that was actually well done. To me it looks like it was drawn from a single point of view, where naturally the angles of each window and buttress etc. are different from each other relative to the beholder, most obviously when you compare the roofs.