naraburns nihil supernum
6mo ago
(text post)
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Israel-Gaza Megathread #1
This is a megathread for any posts on the conflict between (so far, and so far as I know) Hamas and the Israeli government, as well as related geopolitics. Culture War thread rules apply.
No electricity, water, or fuel for Gaza until hostages freed - Israel
Israel's Energy Minister Israel Katz says the siege of Gaza will not end until Israeli hostages are released.
In a social media post, Israel Katz said no "electrical switch will be turned on, no water hydrant will be opened and no fuel truck will enter" until the "abductees" are free.
I think this is a smart move. Even if the hostages being released remains very unlikely, it puts more of the moral burden for the siege on the Gazans, who do (broadly) support Hamas.
A mass scale war crime to block food and water to 2.3 million people. Using war crimes to punish a population is an excellent way to get the world to hate you and the victims to never forget.
Does "the world" or its hate matter? US is firmly on-side and the brief mainstreaming of pro-Palestinian sentiments in the Democratic Party seems to have been reversed. Starmer is defending them right now I saw. Egypt's noises amount to refusing to take refugees.
The nations that matter are either on-side or cowed. "The world" will do what it does: nothing. The world doesn't act, nations do. And some matter more than others
I wish you were right about the importance of world opinion, but I strongly suspect you are not. It seems like something people mainly bring up when convenient.
The rest of the world is 75% of GDP and 85% of the global GDP ppp. If the US wants to become genocidal and increase its reputation as extremely aggressive it will accelerate the shift away from the US globally. Most middle eastern countries trade more with China as they haven't invaded middle eastern countries.
Besides the point made below, not everything is about trade. That is what the situations in Ukraine & Israel prove. That's an assumption from happier times.
Israel and the US could avoid trading entirely, but having a carrier strike group show up to remind everyone to "be careful" has value beyond mere economics.
Tomorrow Kenya could throw mountains of cash at Israel, but it wouldn't replace that sort of support when the chips are down.
Most Middle Eastern countries trade more with China because it's a manufacturing powerhouse that gives them a lot of money in exchange for their resources, which it is relatively lacking in compared to the USA. Not invading Middle Eastern countries barely plays a role in it.
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Notes -
No electricity, water, or fuel for Gaza until hostages freed - Israel
[From the BBC news live tracker]
I think this is a smart move. Even if the hostages being released remains very unlikely, it puts more of the moral burden for the siege on the Gazans, who do (broadly) support Hamas.
A mass scale war crime to block food and water to 2.3 million people. Using war crimes to punish a population is an excellent way to get the world to hate you and the victims to never forget.
Does "the world" or its hate matter? US is firmly on-side and the brief mainstreaming of pro-Palestinian sentiments in the Democratic Party seems to have been reversed. Starmer is defending them right now I saw. Egypt's noises amount to refusing to take refugees.
The nations that matter are either on-side or cowed. "The world" will do what it does: nothing. The world doesn't act, nations do. And some matter more than others
I wish you were right about the importance of world opinion, but I strongly suspect you are not. It seems like something people mainly bring up when convenient.
The rest of the world is 75% of GDP and 85% of the global GDP ppp. If the US wants to become genocidal and increase its reputation as extremely aggressive it will accelerate the shift away from the US globally. Most middle eastern countries trade more with China as they haven't invaded middle eastern countries.
Besides the point made below, not everything is about trade. That is what the situations in Ukraine & Israel prove. That's an assumption from happier times.
Israel and the US could avoid trading entirely, but having a carrier strike group show up to remind everyone to "be careful" has value beyond mere economics.
Tomorrow Kenya could throw mountains of cash at Israel, but it wouldn't replace that sort of support when the chips are down.
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Most Middle Eastern countries trade more with China because it's a manufacturing powerhouse that gives them a lot of money in exchange for their resources, which it is relatively lacking in compared to the USA. Not invading Middle Eastern countries barely plays a role in it.
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