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PaperclipPerfector  2yr ago (text post)   31204 thread views

Culture War Roundup for the week of February 19, 2024

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McNamara was never a general. He was the CEO of Ford.

He was our longest serving SecDef.

The guy who is the boss of the generals.

Don’t evade the point just because @somedude messed up a detail that doesn’t change the substance of the point.

And that point would hat be?

If there is an argument that hes trying to make i dont see it. In the meantime McNamara's legacy as SecDef is one of why no one should ever listen to WEIRD systematizing utilitarian types who think they can fix things with this one weird trick.

I still don't understand what argument you think you're making either then or now.

The thing that MacNamara is famous for in military circles and the thing you seem to be referencing is his efforts to make the US Military "More Efficient" by emphasizing technology over troops. Why bother with strict recruitment standards or waste money on training, housing, medical care, etc... if all you need is a gaggle of conscripts to draw fire so the airplanes know where to drop their bombs? Or so the thinking went.

What I don't understand, and what neither you nor the OP, @aardvark2, @SwordOfOccam, Et Al have bothered to explain is how MacNamara acting like the uncharitable strawman of a Silicon Valley Utilitarian is supposed to convince anyone that we ought to start treating minorities as second-class citizens, or has anything to do with HBD, Ashkenazi Jews, or Group differences in IQ.

The claim was only about IQ scores vs real-life tasks in military, that IQ scores do have meaning. You demonstrated low decoupling and went to discuss other McNamara actions (which I happen know to nothing about), well maybe because you can't refute central point? Maybe you meant that lowering IQ threshold for military enlistment was actually good but other McNamara actions are guilty for bad performance of "moron corps"?

No, what I don't understand is how it's supposed to be an argument in favor of HBD and against individual merit.

ETA: or rebutt my claims regarding [current year] academia for that matter.

Who here is arguing against individual merit?

Receipts please.

“HBD” has contested definitions. You seem to be defining it here as some kind of normative claim that we should “sort by race” instead of the “sort by individual IQ” people around here would prefer. Race-blind individual meritocracy, if you please.

I think you’re also probably confused about IQ being used as a filter to sort for high potential individuals and somehow end up trying to disbelieve IQ has the predictive power it does.

Or you have some boutique definition of individual merit.

Do you remember taking the ASVAB?

Do you remember how certain jobs had a minimum GT score? Do you recall jokes about people who needed waivers?

The US military did studies in the WWII era that showed dumb people are more likely to fuck things up and be bad at their job. So the US military tries to keep the real dummies out altogether, and requires above average scores for many jobs. Becoming a pilot requires passing an extra test with a general aptitude section. Getting into the Defense Language Institute requires a good score on a language-learning aptitude test, which basically measures verbal IQ.

MacNamara decided to lower the minimum IQ to expand options for recruits/draftees. It did not go well.

So the moral of the story is that IQ is real and it matters.

You believing MacNamara made bad decisions is in line with him making a bad decision about lowering IQ requirements.

You’re smart enough that we should not have to tell you that if you enlist a bunch of low IQ people there’s going to be “disparate impact.”

Obviously there’s an HBD angle.

https://old.reddit.com/r/slatestarcodex/comments/8syjn9/gwerns_review_of_mcnamaras_folly_the_use_of_lowiq/

McNamara ignored established DoD policy based on intelligence testing and job performance.

It didn’t go well.

It’s a famous case to cite when people want to believe that IQ doesn’t correlate to job performance. People here would assume you know that context.

Note the serous irony of you criticizing WEIRD utilitarian optimizers for trying to fix things where the “one weird trick” was IGNORING THE WELL-ESTABLISHED LINK BETWEEN INTELLIGENCE AND JOB PERFORMANCE.

You understand half of why McNamara and his Whiz Kids made a mistake; just not the half that contradicts your views and explains why the example was cited.

At no point in your prior comment did you try to make an argument/point, you were just wanted to insult/dunk on me.

Your behavior here is an apt illustration of the wider trends of historical ignorance, sloppy thinking, and "arguments as soldiers" that typify the HBD discourse on this forum.

“It takes someone really smart to be that dumb”

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