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Notes -
Pertaining to the discussion down-thread on the subject of young men and women disliking each other:
The New York Times just published the latest iteration in what feels like a semiannual analysis of dating after 60. The article itself contains the usual "no-duh" realities (old people come with baggage, the machinery doesn't function like it used to) and far-reaching copes (it'll be the best sex of your life, less drama involved), but of particular interest this time around is the unusual tenor of the comment section.
I always enjoy reading these articles and their comments despite (or rather, because of) having a ways to go until becoming a member of the relevant age bracket. The typical reader reaction usually involves stories of finding love late in life, rediscovering the joy of intimacy, meeting new and interesting people to treasure their remaining time with, etc. But man, whether it's a generational shift or a sudden change in attitudes, the elders are much more unhappy this time around. Most of the top comments describe a vehement dislike and/or disgust of the opposite sex, all in a single direction: these women simply hate dudes. Here are some representative excerpts:
"...after a lifetime of having sex with men who have no clue about women's bodies and how to please them, old men waving their bottles of little blue pills and complaining about their 'needs' are not appealing. I'd rather go out for lunch and take in the latest exhibit at a museum with my female friends. They are far more interesting."
"Men need to feel intellectually superior to women and I got sick of playing dumb a long time ago."
"The LAST thing I want is to have someone else to take care of. I enjoy solitude. There is a huge difference between being alone and being lonely."
"75% of domestic violence is committed against women. A third of female murders in 2021 were by their intimate partner. No, not all men. But statistics matter. And they show that women have a lot more to lose in opening their hearts and homes to a man."
"I'm in my 50s and this is already true. The men are fine, but my women friends? They are traveling, learning, reading, exploring. If there was a pill I could take to become a lesbian I'd swallow it so fast...."
"I am appalled by the first photograph in the article which shows a man’s hand around the woman’s neck, even though his thumb is on her cheek. I think it was a thoughtless choice and I am willing to bet that many abused women relived trauma when seeing it."
"Statistically, men are far more likely to leave their wives when the woman gets a cancer diagnosis."
This is the rhetoric that younger generations are hearing from their parents and grandparents. Lifetimes spent with and for another person, only to openly resent those decades of effort late in life. With the hysteria of "sexual assault" at the other end of the spectrum, both independent sexuality and committed intimate relationships are massively disincentivized (or at least, that's how it looks to someone just beginning to figure out the structure of their life). The only guarantee of a lifetime of happiness, it seems, is to stay free of interpersonal bitterness, free of legal and social humiliation, free of sacrificing your own interests for someone who hates you; to live an entire life alone.
How do you convince a 22-year-old of either sex that their perception is mistaken, that there is value in seeking committed relationships with another person?
It is good if young people figure out how to spot lies, especially spotting the cases where people are lying to themselves.
Older women in the dating game have a clear reason for being bitter. Nature really screws them over. Their physical looks / attractiveness to men peaks in their late teens or early 20's. They age out of safely having kids in their early 40's. There goes two of the main reasons for dating/marriage: (sexual) fun and raising kids. I feel bad for them.
The comments section reflects lots of copium being thrown out. I see sexual frustration (which to me seems like a problem with partner selection). I see abrasive personalities (men don't need to feel smarter, but talking down to them like a kid becomes tiring for them to listen to). I see people buried in the culture war losing grounding with reality (most violence is committed by young testosterone fueled men. It nearly ceases to be a real concern later in life.)
I don't think this will heavily impact younger generations. I doubt younger generations are even willing to listen to older generations. They'll figure out sex and love on their own. Or they won't figure it out because of other more important trends.
Sex and committed relationships are something that I think people realize has value because of peer effects. I remember highschool: some girl in the class was the first normalish girl to have sex in a relationship, and then many other girls in school took it as their cue that it was ok to start having sex, and many boys took it as their cue that it was ok to start asking for sex. There was also a wave of breakups because of college separation.
As opposed to what?
As opposed to men, whose desirability to the opposite sex tends to increase between their early twenties and early forties, and who are able to conceive a child for a far longer proportion of their lifespan.
True, but that doesn't mean men have it better overall.
Of course not, but on the narrow metrics of "desirability over time" and "fertility over time" I think it's fair to say men have it better than women and thus "women get shafted by nature" is a reasonable characterisation.
Perhaps if you're comparing the derivative, but it seems that the actual value matters more than the direction. If Elon Musk loses a million dollars, he's still better off than me if I got a 2 million dollar windfall.
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