This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Another abortion case (edit: this article is is based off of and links to a lengthy ProPublica article on the case) finds its way to the front page of reddit. To its credit, it's not the ragebait that the "mother-fails-to-go-to-hospital-after-days-of-heavy-bleeding-caused-by-abortion-pills" seen recently.
Wait, what? Two ultrasounds? One ultrasound confirming no heartbeat wasn't enough? The article heavily winks that it was all due to that crummy heartbeat law:
But wait a minute, what does the law itself say? Per Wikipedia:
Okay, sure, it's a little vague on what emergencies are. But I think you could pretty easily argue that a deadly infection is a medical emergency. Especially after you already have one ultrasound confirming no heartbeat.
As the article says, this is one of two cases where someone died upon waiting for two ultrasounds. At what point is this medical malpractice that has little to do with abortion laws? I have to wonder if the doctor is an activist doctor that is morally opposed to the heartbeat bill and is willing to let people die to further the cause. If someone's on the brink of death, you should treat them, legality should be an afterthought. But to wait for two ultrasounds, it seems like saving people was the afterthought here.
Edit: They also turned her away for sepsis without treating her, as The_Nybbler points out. Hmm, seems like abortion laws aren't entirely the reason for her death. You kind of have to treat people for that instead of just shrugging that you can't kill her fetus and then send her home. In fact, maybe the sepsis caused the fetus to die? But they missed that it was sepsis.
From the source propublica article:
You can read the relevant statute here is §171.205. The additional regulatory burden is not an accident. It’s one of the main mechanisms by which Texas is reducing abortions performed in-state.
I expect the goalposts to recede into the distance as the usual suspects try to place the blame somewhere, anywhere but on the pro-life bloc.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link