This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
All 4Chan boards have been down since Monday evening in an apparent cyberattack. Rumors circulating the 4Chan refugee community in the Down Detector comments section indicate that the site was penetrated by hackers approximately one month ago. The damage inflicted was extreme. Statements by 4Chan’s (strictly unpaid) janitorial staff indicate the site could be down for weeks. Hope is rapidly dimming that the site will be back at all.
There are a number of both ideological and state actors that could be responsible for the attack: the Israeli Mossad, the Ukrainian SBU, the American Central Intelligence Agency, any number of Democratic Party functionaries. But at this time the provenance of the attack is unknown, and no one has taken credit.
What is also unknown is the political ramifications of the Id and meme generator of the internet being abruptly taken offline. Almost all memes on the internet originate from 4Chan and without it, the wellspring of internet creativity and culture will die with it.
Also unknown is what the effect will be of hundred of thousands of Chan refugees migrating across the internet. 4Chan is well known as a containment unit and gulag for the most dangerous ideological elements on the internet. The level of weaponized autism that stands to escape can only be equated to a earth shaking digital Chernobyl.
The final unknown and most troubling question is whether coffee is in fact good for you.
I wonder if 4chan getting hit by the bus will enable some innovation in the anonymous posting space (like how Futaba Channel/4chan's direct Japanese template first flowered as a replacement when 2ch/its text-only predecessor went down), or the whole concept was just waiting for its overdue demise. Any interesting alternatives to watch?
This is why there should be an open source maintained posting space. Private posting boards and social media never need to innovate since they have a significant moat due to network effects and thus face little competition.
We had the perfect fora in Usenet, and then everyone decided to just give up and hand over the keys of discourse to silicon valley and the US government under the guise of a marginal usability improvement.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
Well, there is 8chan/8kun, which was founded over a decade ago by a guy who thought 4chan was over-jannied
Right, I'm reasonably familiar with them but wasn't terribly impressed. They only really brought the "anyone can make a board" thing as an innovation, nothing about the posting system itself apart from some QoL improvements that had accumulated on altchans over the years. Compare to how 2ch->Futaba involved the addition of images.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link