Be advised: this thread is not for serious in-depth discussion of weighty topics (we have a link for that), this thread is not for anything Culture War related. This thread is for Fun. You got jokes? Share 'em. You got silly questions? Ask 'em.
- 96
- 1
PaperclipPerfector
2d ago
(text post)
1584 thread views
Be advised: this thread is not for serious in-depth discussion of weighty topics (we have a link for that), this thread is not for anything Culture War related. This thread is for Fun. You got jokes? Share 'em. You got silly questions? Ask 'em.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
The Eurovision Song Contest was held this evening, which I haven't watched in about twenty years. A friend of mine suggested that we watch it, but was unsure if she'd be able to host, as her flatmate was insistent on boycotting it in light of Israel being "allowed" to participate. In the end her flatmate was out of the house so we were able to watch it in her flat.
I'd assumed that, given the absence of her anti-Zionist flatmate, we'd be able to enjoy the Eurovision as the trashy, campy experience that was intended, without politics intruding. I was mistaken: my friend, her boyfriend and one of her friends insisted on turning off the stream during Israel's performance and made innumerable derisive comments about them during the night. I'm a coward who wants to keep the peace so I held my tongue for the most part.
Israel received modest double-digit votes from the national juries, but after the audience vote, they rocketed up to first place with an astonishing 357 votes, total. In second place was Austria with 258 jury votes, and in the end Austria clinched it. (I honestly cannot say who deserved it more as, as previously mentioned, they turned off the stream during the Israeli performance. I found the Austrian one a little annoying, and if it had been up to me, based on the performances I actually saw, I would have given it to the Germans.)
I was rather dismayed with how quickly my friend retreated into semi-ironic conspiritorialism: saying that the Eurovision would have to investigate their voting procedures next year to ensure no ballot-stuffing was taking place, or attributing Israel's massive success among the audiences as the result of concerted, strategic voting efforts by "the right". (The idea that foul play must have been involved seems to be a consensus opinion, if /r/Ireland is any indication.) The possibilities that a) normie Europeans legitimately liked Israel's performance on a musical level more than the other countries; or b) normie Europeans voted for Israel for political reasons because they're more sympathetic to the Israeli cause than the Palestinian - seem not to have occurred to her.
I am growing increasingly dismayed by the level of ambient nominally pro-Palestinian (but really anti-Israeli) sentiment in Ireland, but it's comforting to be reminded that it's quite the outlier among European countries.
Things took an even weirder turn when Armenia performed and the conversation turned to the Armenian genocide of the 1910s. My friend's Turkish boyfriend, who'd been enthusiastically participating in the Israel-bashing, suddenly became rather defensive, explaining how it wasn't a genocide but merely ethnic cleansing, and anyway forced marches are completely different from genocide, and anyway how do you even establish intent to exterminate a particular ethnic group, and it's hypocritical of European nations to accuse the Turks of genocide when they've done things that were just as bad if not worse* (it was a real mask-off, vino veritas moment, and even my friend seemed to be a bit taken aback by how worked up he got). I felt like saying - it's a bit rich of you to accuse Israel of genocide on the basis of their having killed ~110,000 Palestinians in the span of 75 years, but dismiss the deaths of 1.5 million Armenians in one year as "mere" ethnic cleansing. My girlfriend, who's nowhere near as sympathetic to the Israelis as I am, admitted that I had a point here. I hate to say it, but the "it's antisemitism" theory seems to have greater predictive power than many of its competing alternatives.
*On this point I agreed with him: the Armenian genocide is at least as reprehensible as, to pick one example, Belgian conduct in the Congo.
I'll add Eurovision to my list of awards requiring the 'correct' ideological adherence.
In fairness, Eurovision faced repeated demands for Israel to be banned from competing, but stuck to their guns, and there's no question that Israel would have been given the award without fuss if they'd gotten the most votes. Some people have drawn analogies with how Russia was banned after the invasion of Ukraine, which seems like a transparent false equivalence to me: Ukraine was invaded by Russia and Ukraine fought back, therefore we ban Russia from competing; Israel was invaded by Palestine and Israel fought back, therefore we ought to ban - Israel?* I mean Palestine aren't in the Eurovision so you can't ban them, but why should you ban Israel?
*I know, I know, Israel "really" invaded Palestine 75 years ago, but come on, surely no one really thinks they started the current war.
As worded, this is almost perfectly symmetrical.
I could very easily write you up four different arguments for which country is equivalent to which, depending on the particular political axe you want to grind:
Russia is Israel and Ukraine is Palestine (I hate Russia and Israel)— Two countries vastly more powerful than their smaller neighbor carry out a blood-thirsty invasion, then play the victim and pretend they are trying to fight terrorism. The only reason they have any problem with “terrorism” is because they were trying to steal the land in the first place. They loudly propagandize the threat the smaller neighbor poses as a cover for their own imperialist land grab. Both theatrically sob and moan about the terrible horrors they suffered during World War II as justification even though it has nothing to do with the present situation
Russia is Israel and Ukraine is Palestine (I like Russia and Israel)— Two strong yet mostly peaceful countries are both antagonized by their smaller neighbor. These small neighbor states are so possessed with bloodthirsty ethnic hatred of their larger neighbor, to the point that they are willing to commit national and ethnic suicide just to spit in the face of the hated larger state. Both the small states commit horrific acts of terrorism, then play the victim when the larger state retaliates to protect its safety. The two smaller states both openly valorize the Nazis out of spite, because the Nazis murdered the hated ethnicities of the large states.
Ukraine is Israel and Russia is Palestine (I like Ukraine and Israel)— Ethnic group has suffered terrible persecution in the past during the Holodomorocaust. Ethnic Group decides that the only way to prevent such deprivations in the future is to have a state of their own. They bravely set out to create an independent state. Their neighbor(s) seething with baseless genocidal hatred and justifying themselves with their own completely false historical claims to the land immediately try to snuff out this small base of safety for Ethnic Group. Ethnic Group State fights bravely and secures its existence and independence.
Russia is Palestine and Ukraine is Israel (My brain has been melted by years of dank 4chan may mays)— Two based and trad-pilled peoples heroically fight against the evil (((them))). It’s an uphill battle for both of our heroic groups of Chads, because their degenerate enemies are both supported by the hated ZOG empire of America and NATO. For some reason, people keep telling me to “post hand”.
More options
Context Copy link
Fuck, thanks.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link