This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Elon is on the warpath again, this time Apple is in his crosshairs. He made a bunch of tweets this morning about Apple being anti free speech. This pertains to two possible developments: Apple possibly stopping advertising on Twitter. And Apple threatening action against the Twitter app, according to Musk (Apple has not confined either). [1] I don't see how these are related. Apple's cutting ad spending does not imply it being anti-speech or anti-Musk or whatever. But the timing is suspicious. Elon by going up against Apple has met his match. This not the NYTs, but a 2-trillion dollar company that is like an economy in and of itself. it will be interesting to see how this plays out. Apple has the power to create or destroy businesses , through its app or supply line .
[1] https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2022/11/28/musk-apple-app-store-twitter/
Edit: because twitter is fully privately owned, it does not have to report anything, incl financials, so it's impossible to know how it's doing, unless, I suppose, it goes bankrupt and shuts down completely, or if secondary analytic firms show a major drop in traffic, or employees with insider info leaking financials an other metrics. People are speculating about what will happen to Twitter, but we will have no way of knowing. It's step step above in secrecy than an already public company undergoing a new management; we're talking new management + secrecy.
The actual order of Musk’s tweets implies that he thinks withdrawing advertising dollars is suppressing free speech, which is a perverse concept of “free speech”, wherein a private company is compelled to put their ad dollars towards another company. And let’s put aside it could be something to do with Musk firing a huge percentage of the ad sales and marketing teams, and Apple doesn’t want to throw money into some black hole where they aren’t getting analytics back.
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1597285572699074560
It's not what they do, it's why they do it.
If the reason for Apple's withdrawal of advertising dollars is "I'm knowingly and nefariously trying to use my money to pressure you into silence" then I'd say it would take a perverse concept of free speech to not see that as violating it.
This has really jumped the shark.
It’s not “pressure into silence” to say that a firm doesn’t want their brand advertising shown alongside content they don’t like.
I don’t see lots of firms advertising on PornHub or DraftKings, that doesn’t imply they don’t believe PH l/DK can do their thing.
More options
Context Copy link
What is the evidence that the motivation is silencing Musk or Twitter rather than, say, that Musk's recent wave of unbannings includes many accounts that violate Apple's objectionable content policy for apps?
You mean... the public list of speech they want to suppress? That makes Apple even more obviously an enemy of Free Speech. They already strong-armed Tumblr into banning porn.
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link