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How much more suspicious activity and lucky coincidences would there need to be to convince you (if you're a current denier) that Epstein was murdered/"allowed" to kill himself?
Because from what I see there's a lot of weird things already. The cameras for in front of his cell are down, guards apparently failed to check in on him (apparently both of them fell asleep despite this being their job), his roommate he's supposed to have for suicide watch is moved out earlier that day without replacement, and two staff members get accused of falsifying records only for the charges to get dropped silently two years after over new years.
Now the one camera that was working has footage released from it only for it to be likely edited video that doesn't even provide a meaningful perspective even if it wasn't edited (so why is it changed and had parts removed? Was something incidentally caught on one of the cameras they didn't shut down?) and a full minute missing along with the other smaller possible cuts, a cut that was completely unmentioned in the inspector general's report but suddenly shows up now. With an excuse that the "missing minute" is a standard reset and the recordings aren't operating at that time yet it now appears to exist according to government leakers.
That same day Epstein was also allowed to make an unmonitored call on a line intended for attorneys only to a non-attorney, with the regional director saying "We don't know what happened on that phone. It could have potentially lead to the incident, but we don't - we will never know" which is another oddity. He claimed he was calling his mother ... his mother has been dead almost two decades before then.
Then afterwards, Epstein's own lawyers contested the official finding and hired their own pathologist who said the injuries were more indicative of homicide by strangulation than normal self hanging.
Then of course we have things like Epstein's sweetheart deal maker Alex Acosta being a literal high level member of the government stepping down only a month before the suicide. Was he distancing himself? Cause that's a mighty odd coincidence too to leave right around that time.
And we get told all sorts of things about having files ready for release, only for them to apparently not actually exist like all the files sitting on Pam Bondi's desk. We have leaks of multiple high level politicians (including the current president refusing to release the records who also resigned over the federal government when Epstein died and hired Acosta earlier) with close connections to him. We have intelligence operatives and high level officials trying hard both directly and indirectly as anonymous sources to deny accusations he was working for them which many powerful people are trying to tout as evidence. Which fair, I expect them to deny if it's not true. But also I expect them to lie if it is true.
Like oh really spy agencies, half your job is to be skilled liars and we're just supposed to take your word for it. People can't be this lacking in self-awareness right? So why do so many of the powerful people with connections to Epstein apparently lack this understanding and think it's compelling counter evidence by itself?
Like obviously none of these things in their own are proof by themselves. If they were, we wouldn't be having a discussion like this we would just say "look at the 100% proof it happened". But a lot of truthful things don't have 100% proof. I'm pretty sure OJ Simpson is a murderer despite not having seen it myself and him being found not guilty. I'm pretty sure Casey Anthony killed her daughter. There's a really strong likelihood Micheal Jackson molested some children. Carole Baskin (although a bit weaker of a suspicion) might have been involved in the disappearance of her husband. None of these have hard conclusive evidence, yet none of these are odd to believe.
And just like those examples, there's a whole lot of weird oddities and coincidences and suspicious behavior around Epstein, his death, and the information on him and his connections that it seems pretty reasonable to suspect his supposed suicide wasn't entirely legit. Outside of 100% proof, how much more would be needed before it stops being "just a conspiracy theory"?
I was struck recently by this article talking about how the underlying anxieties are more or less true in both the conspiracy and non conspiracy versions (powerful financiers getting away with stuff and having undue influence, etc) but here is how it phrased what it called the two notable holes:
I mean, isn’t it a lot easier and less suspicious if he dies earlier? Aside from what I view to be some major logistical problems with a quick three minute in and out strangulation, though I admit I’m not well read in to the nitty-gritty. And:
Epstein literally attempted suicide a few weeks before, and actually did right about when he was denied bail and it became increasingly clear that the best case scenario for him still would involve lengthy amounts of jail time. He’s a billionaire, used to much nicer things, and was not in a nice prison. As far as suicidal logic goes, that seems pretty normal? And incompetence by prison guards is definitely my base expectation. Shit is boring, pay is often bad, and the job doesn’t attract the best.
My hypothetical plan for killing the guy would basically be "contact some organized criminal enterprise that has associates already in said prison, and guards already on the payroll, and arrange for there to be a window where those associates can access the cell just long enough to strangle the guy and leave without being observed."
I assume that targeted hits in prison are an order of magnitude or so more common than hits outside of it (in the U.S.). So we just need means and opportunity.
Ironically putting him in prison allows you MORE control over weird variables, rather than having to arrange for him to be suicided outside of prison, where he has some freedom of movement and can set up countermeasures, AND you will have to do a lot more cleanup of evidence.
This particular facility is better known for several rape settlements (about guards), a beating settlement, and holding El Chapo for a bit. I don’t get the vibe that it’s the kind of jail, due to its nature as higher security, where gangs have the run of it… not to say it isn’t plagued by typical jail management stuff. I looked a bit into the history of the place. There’s a few cases where a guard smuggled in cell phones, various drugs, and lots of other contraband, but one was for two people and was a money making scheme. The other was three guards and the inmates had local gang connections (they are after all criminals from the area in many cases) however the guards didn’t. By all accounts the place was miserable - worse than Rikers said one inmate, with a mountain of lurid corroboration. El Chapo himself allegedly had a mental breakdown after staying there for a just few months. All this combines to me to suggest the normal official outcome is more likely.
Now you’ll never hear me call it impossible. It’s plausible beyond a superficial level. But far from likely. Not likely enough IMO that treating it as a worst case scenario is logical to do. For the guards to escalate to murder of a high profile suspect like that a noticeable amount of money would have to change hands and the feds are pretty good at money tracking, for whatever else they sometimes lack.
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Are you basing this on actual knowledge of the prison system, or your own interpolations based on TV and movies?
Actual knowledge in the sense that I've read about the topic a bit. They exist, and they have extensive influence inside prisons.
I have not been to prison.
The main point I believe is that most prison gangs have a ready supply of guys who are in for life and are thus willing to commit murders if ordered to do so, and if not can still coerce someone to do a murder for them.
Most of said gangs have affiliated orgs outside the prison that can act as points of contact. Since criminals outside prison anticipate going to prison in the future, the outside guys really want to stay in the inside guys' good graces.
If you want somebody who is currently in a prison dead, this is the most straightforward approach I can think of, which avoids having to sneak your own independent contractor in and out without leaving much trace.
As I said in another comment, and would be blindingly obvious if you had read the official report, Epstein wasn't in the general population. He had limited contact with other prisoners. Furthermore, this was more of a jail than a prison, with people moving in and out regularly. Epstein was intentionally segregated from other prisoners for the explicit purpose of protection; this theory doesn't comport with the known facts.
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