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naraburns  nihil supernum  1yr ago (text post)   3034 thread views

Small-Scale Question Sunday for January 1, 2023

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I believe that Indian restaurants make food less spicy for non-Indian patrons and spicier (or at least regular spicy) for Indian patrons. This belief stems from a) Indian friends telling me that the white-washed Indian restaurants they've gone to aren't nearly as spicy as home, and b) me ordering the spiciest dishes (generally vindaloo) and not being phased by the spiciness.

I'd like to run some experiments to determine how true this is. I have practically zero experimental design experience and would like input/advice.

Here's my basic plan:

  1. Order vindaloo takeout under a white name and pick up

  2. Wait 30 min to prevent order batching

  3. Order vindaloo takeout under an Indian name and pick up

  4. Cool both in the refrigerator for two hours (this is to blind me to which dish is which by temperature)

  5. Mark both to distinguish white vs. Indian (do this in a way that doesn't allow me to see)

  6. Heat them both up evenly

  7. Randomize so I don't know which dish I am eating

  8. Sample one dish

  9. Cleanse my palate (to start at spiciness zero)

  10. Sample the other dish

  11. Compare the two dishes' spiciness

I think recruiting a friend or two would help to add more data points and make the blinding easier/less prone to failure.

Open to any thoughts. And if you're in the Dallas area and interested in participating, let me know!

generally vindaloo

There might be a couple of funny things happening here.

1. They aren't ordering Vindaloo

I have never once seen an Indian order Vindaloo ever (in USA/India). It's actually incredible when I think about it. A lifetime of eating Indian food with Indians (me included), and not a single Vindaloo that was ordered. (and I grew up on the western coast on India where the dish originates from).

Most Indians are likely ordering other familiar dishes like Chicken Tikka Masala and Butter Chicken. The American preparations for these 2 dishes are orders of magnitude sweeter and milder.

For reference. I'd say an Indian style Tikka Masala should land at a 7/10 in spice. A butter chicken should land at a 5/10. American versions are usually lagging on both by 2 points.

So it is likely, that your friends order the milder Tikka Masala or Butter Chicken and continue complaining about it.....while the actually spicy Vindaloo remains underexplored by the Indians.

2. 'Spicy' doesn't mean what you think it means.

Spicy & Mild in an Indian context can mean 3 different things :

I can mean the dish lacks a punch to its smell (aroma, garlic, onions, Kashmiri chilies), lacks khada-masala-heat (think coriander seeds, Kauri methi, or even black pepper. You feel this heat in your heart, not on your tongue) and lacks chilli-heat (Think straight habaneros or cayenne pepper).

In the sense, mild means under-seasoned more so than not-enough-chilies. So you might just be misunderstanding your friends.

American restaurants simply do not use enough aromatics or fresh-khade masale. So even when the food is chili-spicy, it tastes imbalanced. It is just heat for the sake of heat, no proper spiciness as we perceive it.

I believe that Indian restaurants make food less spicy for non-Indian patrons

3. Yes, they do discriminate based on color and accent

When I order spicy food (usually in Hindi or an obvious 1st gen immigrant accent) at Indian restaurants, they always ask me if I want it 'spicy' or 'Indian spicy'. And even if a white person asks for Indian spicy, they will like to see you handle a 7/10 in front of them, before they send out a 9/10 or a 10/10 for you.

Honestly, most Indians don't like a 9/10 or a 10/10 spicy dish either. We simply want our medium-spicy dishes to have fresh ingredients & attain the expected 6/10, instead of the Americanized 4/10s.

My recommendation:

  1. Order common authentic Indian dishes that are supposed to be spicy - Kolhapuri, Solapuri, Saoji, Gongura, Andra etc. They probably aren't popular enough to have multiple spice options. Also, if you know these dishes, it is good sign for the owner to trust that you know what you want with spice. Be warned, these are above what I can take. It can be a lot. There is 1 tier above these too, but they are novelty dishes that exist as a meme, not actual staples.

  2. Speak in broken hindi and enunciate properly. Say "tiKKKAa" instead of "TEEkuh" masala. Order by saying : "Bha-ee-yah, ayyk Chicken tiKKAa masala aaydum spicy kerr kay day-nah". (brother, give me a chicken tikka masala made spicy). That's enough to convince them.

  3. Just tell them you visited India and had Tikka Masala there. And to make it at that spice level. They will buy it.

You know, as a Cajun I can totally buy this explanation of the freshness of spices being a factor; restaurant Cajun food that's been topped up with hot sauce to bring it to the usual spice level just isn't the same as home-cooked food that's been made to be that spicy.

I am always surprised at how similar Cajun traditions seem to western-Indian traditions. I made Gumbo yesterday, and it almost felt like I was making an Indian curry. (The dark roux was obviously a new thing. though)

just isn't the same as home-cooked

This is true about so many southern American dishes. A fresh homemade-made Biscuits and Gravy always lives up to it's hype, and restaurant B&G tastes like goop on a golf ball.

I’ve heard indians in the south tend to buy seasonings and the like from Cajun grocers.

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