This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Ah, that is less political than I imagined. As traumatic as that may have been I have to give a hearty lol at the situation. The Motte has so many interesting characters…
Are you sure you should be posting this publicly? Anyway, as you’re unusually forthcoming I have to ask. You claim to have a dozen illegal VNs and have written illegal fanfiction but all of this has zero sexual appeal to you? I have nothing against pedophiles but you must admit this sounds a bit curious and difficult to believe.
Anyway I hope you’re doing better now and have recovered without any lasting damage, either physical or social
I mean, it is a political issue, just not one that's culture-war-charged at the moment.
As noted, I posted a tell-all suicide note that got forwarded to the police. Everything I said above is a matter of public record, tied to my real name. So, at this point, why hide it?
I have three dozen legal VNs (or, well, legal to own; I pirated them, but that's neither here nor there). Also, I misspoke a little: many of those VNs with loli scenes also have non-loli scenes which do appeal to me (some of which still involve characters canonically under 18; paedophilia is the paraphilia of being attracted to prepubescents, and puberty is a long way before 18). But, yeah, some of them I find basically unarousing and would still recommend to people who also won't find them arousing! Saya no Uta and Marunomi, for sure (though, y'know, massive content warning; both are in the horror genre - without the limitations normally imposed on that genre in Western media by needing to be legal for kids to view - and Saya in particular gave me nightmares as a 20-year-old; I'm marking this post 18+ in part because I'd generally rather kids didn't look into those).
The fanfic I wrote... there are some parts of it that push some of my buttons, which does have something to do with why I wrote it, but the work as a whole is not my preferred prurient reading because I followed certain things to their logical, and frankly rather nauseating, conclusions. What can I say? I treat fictional worlds very seriously, and won't just handwave things whether for taste or "taste". "But the aaaaart" doesn't disappear as a thing just because one's writing sexually-explicit content.
I guess I have.
More options
Context Copy link
Anime is in a peculiar situation because it is a very detail-light art style. A petite woman of thirty and a girl of 14 can only be distinguished by context and accessories.
Combine that with a culture that sets a lot of stories between 14-18 and you get a lot of risqué works that technically feature underage characters but don’t trigger ‘hell naw’ reactions in non-paedophiles that way a photo of an actual child would. Their age isn’t really relevant except that it means they are in fun-school culture rather than boring-office culture where the story couldn’t happen because everybody is being worked to death.
Then fan of Doki Doki Mai Haruto writes a fanfic where their favourite characters make good on their romantic tension / crush and suddenly they are a CP writer depending on jurisdiction.
I have been waiting all my life to see someone attempt the Shinobu Defense.
"Your Honor, that is not a 13 year old girl. That is a 300 year old vampire."
"She's smart and fun and loyal and everything, but every time we do it I have to turn the light off and imagine she's a fully-matured human female, your honor, or I am unable to achieve sufficient erectness"
More options
Context Copy link
Lol. Okay, sometimes it’s a fig leaf.
But from a purely descriptive perspective I would bet that, say, 99% of Madoka Magica slash writers are not paedophiles.
If anything, anime lovers are closer to Zoophilia, as anime girls are just cats
/images/1758901319908629.webp
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link