daguerrean
14hr ago
Democrats seem to get to just ignore immigration laws they don’t like (sanctuary cities), it seems regrettable but reasonable for Republicans to do the same.
daguerrean
19hr ago
Venezuelans, some of whom had not been accused of any crime and were in the middle of asylum cases, were deported to El Salvador
I'm not speaking on the legality of this because I don't know and don't care what the current legal situation is. But, this seems perfectly reasonable to me. If their asylum cases had not been resolved in their favor, what makes them entitled to be in the United States? The impression I get from comments like this is that our asylum/refugee system has essentially worked like this: get to the border somehow, say magic words that trigger asylum/refugee case (that you are fed by activist organizations that coach you), get let into the United States with some maybe-in-future court date that might resolve your asylum case years down the line. Until then, you basically have free run of the country and can disappear trivially.
Frankly this system seems absolutely ridiculous. I don't know why we accept asylum seekers at all, there's no reason for it. And the faster we can dismantle this absurd system and start deporting the people abusing it the better.
daguerrean
1d ago
It’s not that egregious IMO, not like you would see Nazi accusations on Reddit. It was just sort of a glib or snarky response to your comment. It didn’t seem overly serious
daguerrean
1d ago
This is a very interesting post as an insight into the protest attending mindset. It is very strange to me, he seems continually befuddled by the extremes of hostility ("To me the yelling and taunting at police was misplaced aggression, and counter productive but it was their town, not mine"/"Somehow capitalism and the general economy have been implicated, although I cannot figure how") but nonetheless attends the protests regardless despite it being not his town. He seems to regard the protesting as mostly a harmless social activity that he groups together with going to record stores and restaurants. I get the sense his wife is basically dragging him to this ("I am not as brave as my wife, who acts from a strain of moral clarity that can sometimes be daunting") and he is playing the role of an agreeable husband that regards this like his wife dragging him to a museum or board game night, so he is happy to go there and shout obscenities for a few hours in between other tourist activities. I know it sounds cliche, but there is just such beta energy radiating off the entire post.
daguerrean
1d ago
Calling the left cucks is an extremely common sexualized insult from the right.
Well a couple of things.
First you listed a number of false positives, people being wrongfully arrested/deported. Any sufficiently large scale operation will have mistakes. If you tried to crack down on disability fraud surely you would end up mistakenly depriving some genuinely deserving people. As you said, the optimal level of crime is not zero, similarly, the optimal level of wrongful convictions/arrests/deportations isn't zero. If you could demonstrate that it was egregiously error-prone then there would be cause for concern. But at the moment I don't trust the media to be objective. Surely the Obama administration occasionally wrongfully detained a legal immigrant but the media wasn't shouting it from the rooftops when it happened.
Regarding the theatricality. Of course there is an element of theater to it, as there is with the protesting. What good does blowing a whistle or shouting "fuck you Nazis" actually do to impede their activities? Basically nothing, it is entirely theater. The theatricality of ICE and the focus on Minneapolis is largely about sending a message loudly, publicly and clearly that "no, blue states do not get to veto federal laws whenever the choose as they have a history of doing." The protestors do theater and ICE does counter theater. We can argue that their theatricality is losing in the court of public opinion, but I appreciated it at least.
daguerrean
1d ago
The amusing thing to me is that there is an unwritten seventh role on which the whole operation depends, "retard who gets shot." If the operation proceeded as written with everyone playing their roles perfectly, nothing would happen. So some women stand on the opposite side of the street from ICE and blow whistles for a while, so what? This whole system only functions when somebody is stupid enough to get shot. Of course, none of the participants know that, least of all the people that get shot, but it is how it works nonetheless.
daguerrean
2d ago
All this is true, but this doesn't excuse the shooting. An analogy would be the classic one feminists hate, woman walks down the street in a bad neighborhood alone at 2AM drunk in a skimpy outfit, gets raped. She was stupid and this was a predictable outcome of her decisions, but that doesn't mean the rapist is suddenly a good person and his actions are excused and he should get off scot-free. Here, the guy was stupid and his actions predictably resulted in his death. However, the evidence certainly seems to point to the ICE agent shooting him in the back when he was already subdued by about 5 agents, his gun was taken and the agent with the gun was already well clear of the scuffle. There is just no excuse for that. Additionally the administration is obviously lying by calling him a domestic terrorist that tried to assassinate law enforcement. This situation feels very clearcut and easy to interpret.
daguerrean
2d ago
There's something very David French about this, but I suppose that's just being Christian, and what makes them such frustrating fellow travelers. I think it's the sense that they would rather lose as long as they satisfy their own personal feelings of being a good person first and foremost. It's like a desire for martyrdom or something, they active want to lose while feeling righteous about their own goodness. Because if your goal is "live in a neighborhood without violent drug addicts", handing out free things to violent drug addicts directly undermines that. With allies like these, who needs enemies? Like, one could very easily donate to some kind of cause that aids the homeless without actively undermining one's own neighborhood. If there were actively violent drug addicts congregating outside my house and I found out my neighbor was giving them free shit I would be just about ready to kill my neighbor.
daguerrean
2d ago
The suspect may have been wanted for assault and was known to be illegal which caused DHS to prioritize deporting him. Why do you assume they delegated the arrest for assault to DHS? He may have been wanted by two separate organizations for different reasons. This seems like the plain reading.
daguerrean
2d ago
Your choice, at the margin, increased such situations.
Indeed. The fact he reacted to a homeless guy sleeping in a park within sight of his house with “Won’t someone think of the poor homeless guy and help him” is exactly why we are in this mess in the first place. We need more people whose first thought is “Ew, get that disgusting bum out of my park” if we are ever to have hope of solving this.
daguerrean
2d ago
I have it on good authority this country was founded on White Supremacy so I think we should do away with such racist traditions
We can see the agent has already disarmed him and is holding the gun in his hand and is walking away, he is several feet away by the time the gunshot goes off. In the video, you can see he looks over his left shoulder when the first shot goes off, not down at the gun in his right hand. Even if he wasn't sure where the sound came from, he would've felt the gun discharge. Furthermore, none of the other agents whip around and look at the guy running away with the gun, which would've been the source of the sound. The overwhelming evidence points to the gunshot being from the ICE agent that had pulled out his gun and pointed it at the guy's back immediately before.
daguerrean
3d ago
Exactly, if the gun went off in his hand even if we wasn't sure where the sound came from he would've felt it. The fact he looks over his shoulder is pretty much proof (as far as I'm concerned) it wasn't the gun in his hand that went off.
Two experiences don't need to be identical in every way to be serving the same basic purpose and impulses. And you know there's the whole "you never step in the same river twice" thing, so it's always possible for motivated persons to say "No these two things really have important differences." For example, it is often said that sports games and sports fandom serve the same impulse as actual tribal warfare. You go to a special place, decked out in your tribe's colors, wearing scary facepaint and you scream and shout and exhort your tribe's warriors to smash the warriors from the other tribe. Obviously we could sit here all day and list differences between actual warfare and football, which of course are numerous and significant, but that doesn't mean that there isn't some real deep similarity here. I think the same could be said for confession and therapy. Of course the differences are numerous, but at a very basic level, you go to a special place you don't visit in every day life and you talk to a special person (not your brother, friend, wife or coworker) where you can let out your deepest, darkest secrets without fear of social consequences, and you come away being told that "it's okay to feel how you're feeling and it's all gonna be okay", although the exact path to being okay might be different (saying some number of prayers vs taking medication vs whatever).
daguerrean
3d ago
and tear out pages that he already read. To lessen his baggage load.
This feels performative in some strange way because at most it could save him the weight of a single book (because when he's done he doesn't have to tear any pages out, just give the book away whole), and most of the time he's only saving the weight of about 50% of pages in a single book. In that way it reminds me of people that slice books in half along the spine when they carry them to read on the NYC subway, also very performative.
I think it is attempting to signal what you said above, like an anti-fetishism, and signal a seriousness about the information within as opposed to the object itself. It also reminds me of the masculine fetishizing of optimization as a sort of ascetic ideal. Like you have hikers bragging about micro-optimizations, shaving grams off their pack weight, or bodybuilders eating nothing but plain boiled chicken. All these things strike me as equally performative for the vast majority of partakers.
daguerrean
3d ago
Gun went off accidentally after he was disarmed
Guy reaches for waistband
I really don't think these things are true, there is basically no evidence for an accidental discharge and the first gunshot happens very shortly after the first ICE agent pulls his gun and puts it up against the guy's back. By then, the agent that had disarmed him has already turned and is heading away, so there is no active struggle over the gun. I think the evidence points towards the ICE agent shooting him much more than an accidental discharge.
I don't see any evidence the guy reached for his waistband, and it's kind of irrelevant anyway because at that point his gun had already been taken and the ICE agent was walking away with it. And assuming the first discharge wasn't accidental, at that point he had already been shot in the back once.
daguerrean
3d ago
I'm a convert, was an atheist for most of my adult life
Maybe I'm mixing you up with someone else, but I thought you alluded to being a teenager in other places?
daguerrean
3d ago
I'm just so viscerally disgusted by this method of "shrieking women" protest, blowing whistles nonstop, trying to be as annoying as possible that I can't even be objective about this. This seems like an obvious failure of this type of protest strategy, anything that's annoying to ICE agents will also be annoying to the audience. I just can't bring myself to sympathize with people who are being maximally annoying, it's like a bully kid doing the whole "I'm not touching you" thing. This protest method may be effective in generating these snapshot moments of violent reprisal that work on some people, but for me it has the exact opposite effect. I watch about five seconds of one of these videos and have decided quite firmly that I hate the protestors. Additionally the way women react to violence just disgusts me, you see this in body cam footage from ghetto shootings too. The moment something happens dozens of fat women materialize somehow and just start shrieking their heads off. Maybe it has some sort of evolutionary purpose, like summoning aid or something, but god, whatever evolutionary impulse is totally absent in me.
Perhaps it was unjustified, and if so, so what? Any sufficiently large scale operation will have things go wrong, especially when you have large numbers of people that are trying to harass, antagonize and violently obstruct things. Chernobyl happened, does this mean nuclear power is evil or forever forbidden? Car accidents happen and vehicular manslaughter happens, does this mean we should abandon cars? I'm not very moved by an individual incident, especially when the victim appears to have gotten into a violent confrontation with ICE, resisting arrest, while carrying a gun, that's Darwin Award territory.
My reaction would be, let's investigate this properly and perhaps prosecute the agents involved. But this should in no way cause us to pause ICE operations and is in fact a very good reason for the media to stop agitpropping retarded leftists into getting into violent confrontations with ICE.
Edit: For the record, after reviewing all the angles, I can say that the shooting appears to be unjustified. I don't think he reached for his weapon and I don't think it accidentally discharged, I think an ICE agent just basically executed him by shooting him in the back then shooting him a few more times when he attempted to stand. That said, this is an extremely predictable outcome of having a gun in your waistband when choosing to physically confront ICE and resist arrest.
daguerrean
3d ago
I don't understand the point of this rule. It is less a comment and more of a sign saying "[Talk about the recent Minneapolis shooting here]", what is the harm in that? We could just put into Chatgpt "Generate 200 words of filler text that will make Amadan happy that really says nothing about the recent Minneapolis shooting". I would get it if he had some low effort take and posted the link with his only comment being "Looks like another murder by the fascist death squads" but I don't really consider this different from a megathread. If you're starting a megathread, does the post body need to be substantive? No, it is more or less the same just "Talk about the recent Minneapolis shooting here"
Initial thoughts, this reminds me of 2020 in the leadup to BLM. Remember Ahmaud Arbery and Breonna Taylor? I think the Arbery shooting was in February and Taylor in March and then Floyd of course came at the very end of May. In retrospect there was a clear agitation by the media, and it took them about 4 months or so to rile people up enough for mass action. The first case (Arbery) didn't do it and. neither did the second. I think we're seeing a similar agitation by the media for Spring/Summer 2026. I don't think this case will do it (it's a White man that died), but be on the lookout for something in April that finally activates people.
daguerrean
4d ago
You are following the pattern of every poster on here that gets a reputation as some sort of big shot, you have become a jackass that believes you're better than everyone else here because of a posting reputation from years back. Amadan is willing to give you leeway because of "a long record of AAQCs" which you feel entitles you to just be an ass and sneer at everyone. It's always amusing to see this process happen and inevitably lead to flameouts and permabans, I enjoy it immensely every single time :)
daguerrean
4d ago
It may be afforded some additional respect at a low level, but it isn't really afforded prestige, maybe that's a better word for what I'm driving at. If you came from a wealthy, elite family and attended Phillips Exeter or something, would "cop" be considered a valid and respectable career path your family would be proud of? Not really. Tech, finance, doctor, lawyer, academia, those would be considered prestige jobs that would be acceptable for a son of the elite. So while police officers get some ground-level respect at the local diner, it's not really a high prestige. Nobody with a son at an elite private school is saying "I hope he grows up to become a police officer!" And basically the same goes for the military, of course it wasn't always this way but it is now.
Okay, I feel obligated to defend myself. I don't really find anything objectionable in doing things your wife enjoys for the sake of the relationship. It was just that post in particular that gave me a vibe that this man has no agency or convictions while his wife is a shrieking harpy calling the shots in the relationship. The other thing is, he is talking about basically dedicating hours every day of his vacation to standing outside protesting in Minneapolis in January, there is a point where it crosses over from being kind and accommodating to your spouse to being a doormat. You should do things your spouse wants to, but IMO you should also feel comfortable saying "Go by yourself, I don't want to do that." Now granted, my wife doesn't really go out, so the extent of this for me is watching reality shows I don't care for. I usually just go to daguerreotype-related things myself without dragging my wife along. I don't understand why some couple feel the need to do everything together.
You know, in one of your linked comments you had a list of 700 questions which I enjoyed, reminds me I've been meaning to make a survey for Motte users which I should post.
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