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Culture War Roundup for the week of December 29, 2025

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Leading to the obvious question, was this trauma what made Will gay?

I think it was the trauma from the retcon that did it, since Vecna didn't catch Will in S1; he'd just fallen prey to the environment at that point. Though perhaps maybe the spores and the tentacles can infect you with the gay re: Robin, and why the gay characters didn't think the atmosphere in the Upside Down was dangerous when asked. They were already carrying it, you see.


Is Vecna as a metaphor for pedophilla?

Vecna as a metaphor for the show's writers. You've correctly identified that it is child abuse, but not for the reasons you're probably thinking of.

"Let's just use children as props to [ab]use because we're too lazy to write them as actual human beings" is an incredibly apt description of S5, and most of the good parts of S5 were... starring a 14 year old playing a 9 year old in full jailbait uniform for basically no reason (clearly, practical for trudging around in the forest and desert heat)[1]. You do kind of forget that after a while, but it presses the "child beauty pageant" button.

It's a grown woman wearing child-face. Which is consistent with how the rest of the formerly-kid characters act, come to think of it (it's especially jarring with 11, since that character's design means they can't hide it... even though they kind of did in S4), and probably why the writers wouldn't see much problem with it either. After all, how else are you going to convince the audience this [again, obviously grown woman] is A Child? Remember, the original cast was actually physically younger than their stated ages (and, uh, that's how it is in real life too), but if you forget why that works this is the result.

As for those nice, veiny, oral intubation scenes with Vecna... I think they were just going for shock value and stock "villain is a walking pedo stereotype". They had a schedule to keep, after all. That's not really anti-woke, though[2]. It also blows suspension of disbelief because Stranger Danger accompanied the Satanic Panic, and the latter was a massive plot point in S4- there's no fucking way those "kids" should have believed that, and yet.

It's purely there for pandering.

And it didn't even do that effectively, because it basically destroyed that ship (and the teenage girls most interested in it) for a moralizing gotcha. Again, an example of "how adults think sexuality works", not how it actually works[2, again].


Contrast S1, where as you said, the characters acted fucking normal. The kid characters in particular weren't just cheap throwaway props, especially and most relevantly Will, who exercised agency and intelligence every time he was actually interacting with something (and even better- every time he takes the advice of adults- suffers overwhelmingly negative consequences of doing so instead of using his fucking brain; this was a massive plot point in S2 and basically every season thereafter, because [the writers needed a prop, so they made sure] he never learned). And it's not like the writers forgot how to write a character like this, since Derek (of all people) does this every time he's on screen.

[1] Adventuring outfits don't look like this, they look like this. One would expect an artist who draws the latter character nude on occasion to have the more sexualized design, yet in fact the opposite is true.

[2] But it is what traditionalists will think is anti-woke, because they're usually incapable of noticing that "forcing an adult outlook on kids with respect to sex" is the specific mode of abuse (and is correctly called out as a bad thing when it happens to Will in S1), rather than suggesting the actual act itself. It's a very feminine mode of sexual abuse, which men don't usually understand (they can only identify suggestions of the actual act).

It's a grown woman wearing child-face.

I think this is a bit hyperbolic (perhaps deliberately so). Plenty of 14 year old girls are still pretty far from physical adulthood.

Plenty of 14 year old girls are still pretty far from physical adulthood.

Then perhaps they should have cast one that was "still pretty far" rather than heading straight into the uncanny valley?

Even Max, who's supposed to be (and her actor is, to my knowledge) significantly older, actually looks younger than Holly does; the illusion also quickly falls apart when she's standing next to (and being physically overpowered by) the other kid actors.

Then perhaps they should have cast one that was "still pretty far" rather than heading straight into the uncanny valley?

I think they did. I didn't for a second look at Holly Wheeler and think "that's an adult woman".

starring a 14 year old playing a 9 year old in full jailbait uniform for basically no reason (clearly, practical for trudging around in the forest and desert heat)[1]. You do kind of forget that after a while, but it presses the "child beauty pageant" button.

I immediately wondered why they swapped out the actress for Holly with one that was, for lack of a better term, "lolita-esque."

The show was pretty good at finding 'real' looking actors for the kids, even at the expense of them being 'ugly'. Derek being a great example. Holly though, hoo boy. Looked like they even gave her perfectly coiffed eyebrows and she kept the pigtails the entire time rather than swapping to a more practical ponytail. I couldn't ignore that it was like watching a de-aged Sidney Sweeney.

This was made worse when she's next to Max, who is a GREAT representation of a tomboy.

for lack of a better term, "lolita-esque"

I think "lolita-esque"- as in "adult/not-child pretends to be a child pretending to be an adult"- fits just fine.

even at the expense of them being 'ugly'

Wait, which kid character was ugly? I mean sure, 11 is a bit of a gimme there, but "weird and butch" was part of the job description for that one.

In S1, outside of 11, you had:

  • The main character, who absolutely had to be a child star (and he does stand out from the rest in this regard);
  • The intentionally very cute/nerdy/sheltered-youngest-child one [that you'd better get attached to or the story falls apart];
  • The chubby perma-child, but still cute (even into S5, which is why he's the most normal-seeming character in the endgame); and
  • The other one, who was also cute- that may or may not have been his primary appeal for the writers but it's good that didn't matter

And then in S2, we got:

  • Tomboy supremacy

And then in S5, we got:

  • Suck my fat one (which was an excellent casting decision; being cute would have detracted from his character, but he's not outright ugly either)
  • I Can't Believe It's Not Loli, as previously discussed

which kid character was ugly?

Dustin is notable for having an actual deformity. Jonathan is contrasted to Steve as the creepy-looking awkward kid. And there's Derek.

Oh, and Barb, who isn't 'ugly' but could fairly be called 'Homely' and was, I'd say, designed to represent a particular archetype.