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The last time I participated in this community I was in November. When as part of some discussion about how DnD had gone woke or something, /u/RandomRanger posted a very long comment where, to paraphrase, he said that black people were an inferior stupid race who bring crime and dysfunction wherever we go and that in order to stop the west from being "overrun" with blacks, white racists would need to "block" us in a way the didn't account for "international law" and "human rights". I replied calling him a cracker bitch and was temp-banned by the mods.
Now I know my outburst was against the rules, it was uncivil, I was reacting with anger, and I knew at the time I'd get banned for it. But I don't know, when I see someone essentially laying out a justification for bringing back slavery, how am I supposed to respond, as a black person? Am I expected to lay out some "well have you considered..."-ass intellectual rebuttal, Am I supposed to beg and plead for my own rights? "No sir, Please sir, I'm one of da good ones see!" I'm sorry but I don't have the patience for that
When made my first comment here where expressed profound distress over the possibly that HBD is real. I got a lot of responses along the lines of "well, what's it matter to you? you're an individual and population level statistics don't apply to you." I never thought that they applied to me. But when people in this community use HBD and crime statistics to argue that things Jim Crow and Apartheid were good and just and maybe should even be brought back THAT FUCKING AFFECTS ME. I'M BLACK
I remember another person asked me if I sincerely related to black underclass criminals and no I obviously don't but I relate to people like Toussaint Louverture, Malcolm X, Steve Biko. The intelligent black men who dedicated their lives to fighting the people who wanted to keep us in eternal subjugation for all the same goddamn reasons. And when I read what RandomRanger says about how society ought to forcefully disempower black people for the sake of having a "civilized" country. I'm reminded of the poem written by Claude McKay during Red Summer when white supremacists were terrorizing black people across America:
So bring it on! I don't care if we won't win but I'll FIGHT LIKE HELL for my people and if I die I know I'll have died a proud black man who stood for dignity instead of cowering negro who submitted to slavery. I'LL NEVER BE ACCEPT BEING A SLAVE!!!
Now this is the kind of energy holocaust deniers need to cultivate. Proactive. Assertive. 'The holocaust didn't happen, but keep citing Nizkor and it might! Right here, right now!'
I've long felt that the reason progressives and similarly minded don't do well here is that the ruleset is kind of stacked against them. They argue differently. It's a lot more emotional and haughty. It challenges you on a different level. It's more personal. And, frankly, it's also more earnest and fun. They're more viscerally and honestly channeling their emotions through text.
But the flipside of that is well... everyone else can also do that. So whilst this might not be the venue for that kind of clash, I'd also ask, do you really want it to be? I have had faith in some progressives I've argued with. Their wit and tenacity was impressive, if nothing else. But are you one of them? If this is all you can muster before crashing out then I don't fancy your chances.
You're getting a fair amount of sympathy because you're black. I don't understand why. Your post was probably the worst thing one can write and I find everyone coddling you to be absurd to a point where I barely have the heart to engage with it.
If white people can muster the strength to walk past all the white victims of black crime without just calling every black person the n-word all the time, I think you should be able to do something comparable when one of the whites finally has enough and allows themselves to verbally wonder in a scarcely populated recess of the internet whether this whole civil rights thing was worth it.
Comically, your reply was probably the least dignified and most validating argument in favor of such skepticism possible. You offer no sympathy, no understanding, just go straight into the most selfish and aggressively verbalized ingroup/outgroup pathology possible. Leaving no room for interpretation other than that there will be no sympathy for the white devil. He shall continue to give life and limb to the continuous project of racial reconciliation in America to the benefit of your ingroup pathology.
I can't imagine a position less deserving of sympathy than yours. Why you are receiving any is, again, absurd.
To be fair though, if someone was talking about hurting you, then is there much of a meaningful difference if they say it with an emotional passion vs a deadpan matter of fact tone? Either way their intent and meaning is the same, they want to hurt you!
"I want to kill people like you" vs "I want to fucking kill people like you" only really differs in that maybe the emotional passion behind the second makes it more believable. But if we believe both to be equally honest, then what difference is left in actual meaning? Even if we dress it up as "I believe it is beneficial to me and my group if we killed people like you" it's basically the same.
If we have an issue with the swear one but not the other two then it comes off more as prudishness about swearing or "conduct" rather than anything else.
Like look at the mod response
So if they said "I politically believe that people like me are benefited from seeing people with views like you as demonic monsters and that killing you would be a net positive to my group's quality of life" is that really gonna be ok?
Yes, those are the rules. Anyone is free to express their desire to commit torture, rape, and genocide as long as they are polite about it. That may seem ridiculous, but it has worked out for us so far, while other comparable fora have died from lack of engagement or collapsed into (greater) ideological conformity.
It's an interesting sort of prudishness to find support for something like the Holocaust as acceptable, every slur imaginable is allowed, but a little bit of swearing could be beyond the pale if it's found to be "rude".
Is "I am politically working towards the goal that you and your entire people are subhumans who will be subjected to cruel torture and genocide" a polite statement? If so, how about "I'm gonna beat your mother, cause fuck you". Both are hypothetical goals of enacting violence on the other speaker.
I think most people in general society would agree that genocide and murder is worse than just beating someone up and calling them a few swears while doing it, but hey maybe the normies just don't understand what being polite actually means.
As if this place isn't mostly like 7-8 people who are that active
Yeah, it's already severely conformist with how aggressive people are (refer back to how it's circlejerked so hard that calls for violence against someone are seen as more polite than a little swearing) but I'll admit I've seen worse among some of the online tankie groups.
It's not the swearing. Generally, you can swear all you want, though a post that seems to be full of swearing used as punctuation just to be edgy might be modded for being low-effort and trollish.
And slurs are allowed in that you can use the words, but you cannot call people slurs.
What you can't do is engage in personal attacks.
You also cannot make general statements about your outgroup, and generally we will also mod calls for violence.
The Joo-posters are always walking a fine line, because "Here is why the Holocaust is a lie" is an argument you are allowed to make. "Here is why Jews have too much political power" is an argument you are allowed to make. "Here is why we should kill the Jews" (the argument they really want to make) is not an argument you are allowed to make.
No, which is why they aren't allowed to explicitly advocate for that. Steelmanning the Joo-posters and white nationalists, I am sure many of them would say they don't want to subject their enemies to torture and genocide, they just want to send them somewhere else. (You know, like the Nazis just wanted to send the Jews "somewhere else.") It's almost plausible in some cases. And you can make an arguable case for peaceful separation; that's @Hoffmeister's thing, and while I think his project is both infeasible and immoral, I believe he's sincere about it.
Obviously, literal genocide and murder is worse than "beating someone up and calling them a few swears."
But the actual comparison here is "using words" versus "actual physical violence."
You're using the "words are violence" framing here, which is absolutely toxic to the very idea that we can have heated discourse and free speech.
Which is worse: me saying "I think your kind should all be murdered" or you physically assaulting me for saying that?
I would argue that while my words are insulting and inflammatory (and in certain circumstances, but certainly not an internet forum argument, could even be considered threatening) and your anger is understandable, you are not justified in physically assaulting me for saying mean words.
We have more than that, but sure, what's your point? We're a bunch of losers who don't matter, but you hang around here because you need to argue with the losers who don't matter or they might commit genocide?
Who has called for violence against the OP?
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