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Notes -
Stealing this from @ToaKraka in the FF thread:
Our own BJ Campbell wrote that this is one of the important differences between the US and Western Europe. A German or British police officer would have the power to detain all juvenile males wearing a single article of black clothing within a one-mile radius of the robbery and physical evidence wouldn't be suppressed even if obtained without following the proper trail of investigation.
Is the USA shooting itself in the foot there? What will it lose if it changes its legal norms to lower the bar on probable cause and evidence suppression?
Link to the full opinion
Reasonable suspicion for a brief investigative stop is a lower standard than probable cause for a prolonged arrest. (The English word "detention" is a bit misleading here, as in colloquial use it implies a prolonged arrest.)
In this instance it was a detention because the officer stepped infront of the youth and shined his flashlight upon him, and a 'reasonable' youth wouldn't have felt free to leave?
It seems like the youth actually leaving would cut against that.
7:30 on an October evening, I'd want a flashlight too.
Yes. According to the judges: "A reasonable person, with his path impeded by a police officer, the officer asking him investigative questions while another officer stood nearby, and the questioning officer training a flashlight on him, would not have felt free to simply leave the interaction."
(1) The officers stop their car next to KC, get out, and start walking toward him while shining a flashlight at him. This may or may not count as a detention.
(2) KC starts walking away. You can call this evidence against the idea that item 1, standing alone, counts as a detention.
(3) One of the officers deliberately steps into KC's path, blocking him from walking away. At this point (with both item 1 and item 3), a detention definitely has taken place, considering the totality of the circumstances (say the judges).
(4) The officer asks KC what he has in his waistband. KC discards the object (a gun) and flees. If the stop had been lawful, then this would constitute probable cause for an arrest. However, the stop was not lawful.
According to the judges: "The body-camera footage shows that the street was well lit by various streetlights".
Camera footage may look appear brighter than the same scene to the eye and I'd expect a flashlight to illuminate shadows and provide better contrast. Feels very 'vibes' based.
I wouldn't have expected spotlighting to be detention adjacent unless accompanied by, "You there! Stop! Police!" I suspect the counter narrative of being charged with fleeing / obstruction after being 'detained' via spotlighting would also be dismissed.
I think I prefer the sates narrative that he ditched the gun and fled prior to detention and the his fleeing was within seconds of the officer steeping in front of him. I'd like to see the video.
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Thank you, I am not that well-versed in American legal terminology.
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