This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.
Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.
We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:
-
Shaming.
-
Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.
-
Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.
-
Recruiting for a cause.
-
Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.
In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:
-
Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.
-
Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.
-
Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.
-
Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.
On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.
Jump in the discussion.
No email address required.
Notes -
Mayor Mamdani Bends the Knee - and the Problem with Left-Wing Antisemitism
According to Mamdani the initiative entails "investing millions in Jewish cultural centers and nonprofits" as well as bussing students to the Museum of Jewish Heritage. The high-level details are available in the report.
NYC already hosts two dedicated Holocaust Museums and 6 memorials, but the plan also "calls on the federal government to support Holocaust educational centers and museums in New York City, and to continue to support the large number of Holocaust survivors in NYC through existing federal programs. Additionally, the Mamdani administration supports federal legislative efforts to increase Holocaust educational programming." The plan also pledges $2 million capital investment in the design and construction of the Queens Holocaust Memorial.
The plan also includes a $2.5 capital investment in the Center for New Jewish Culture, a Jewish-dedicated private space. The plan also pledges additional NYPD resources for Jewish neighborhoods.
One of the fascinating aspects of this announcement is that it cites and then wildly misinterprets a passage from the Talmud:
The standard print versions of the Talmud, which Jews actually study, specify "mi-Yisrael" or the soul of a Jew. And this gets to the heart of the problem of left-wing antisemitism, especially with notorious left-wing commentators like Hasan Piker. They always denounce antisemitism in their diatribe against Israel. When in fact the right-Wing antisemites are correct that this is not only a problem with Israel, it is actually a problem with the way Jews politically and culturally organize in the United States. It leads to wildly inappropriate and disparate treatment of Jews in which they get all sorts of public funding and support for their dedicated spaces, combined with unlimited cultural veneration and educational propaganda.
This puts the left-wing antisemites in an impossible position, they are unwilling to admit that it's not just an Israel problem or a Netanyahu problem. The game they are trying to play is impossible, and trying to split those hairs just makes them get immediately bulldozed and subjugated in trying to defend themselves from the accusation of antisemitism.
If you're like me you've encountered Jews who were absolutely certain that Mamdani was going to bring Sharia to NYC and expel the Jews or something. Instead we just even more Jewish special treatment and taxpayer-financed privileges from the left-wing Israel critics who are completely in denial of the actual problem.
Huh, you're correct. It's right here, Sanhedrin 37a:
I have to admit that this is a pretty weird verse to cite. It's not particularly relevent to anything mentioned in the announcement. Seems like a plausible dogwhistle.
I get the sense that Mamdani has "cracked the code" so to speak of American politics. Helicopter money isn't enough. The politician must create a salient connection between himself, his political project, and the benefit to the people in the mind of the voter. Giving away 70,000 Met Opera tickets by lottery is, by any rational standard, retarded, but it will be more effective politically than subsidizing ticket prices or opera supply costs could ever be.
Thanks to Schindler's List, the edited version that doesn't specify Jews is possibly the most famous verse that isn't one of the commandments. Could just be part of him playing the media game and knowing what's popular.
Not knowing how to read the original text, is "Jewish" there explicit or just implied?
As a hypothetical, "the people" in the Second Amendment could be translated as "Americans" pretty reasonably for a global audience, but there are probably more than a few "shall not be infringed" stans that would explicitly claim the right should be universal, but probably not to the point of, say, invading Canada to hand out guns to everyone there. I'm not sure I'd claim either way is "correct" per se: the source material is a bit ambiguous.
Google Translate translates the Hebrew text between the first two commas, "诇职诇址诪旨侄讚职讱指 砖讈侄讻旨讎诇 讛址诪职讗址讘旨值讚 谞侄驻侄砖讈 讗址讞址转 诪执讬旨执砖讉职专指讗值诇", as "to teach you that whoever destroys a single soul from Israel"鈥攕o, explicit.
This also indicates that the English translation on the linked page uses bold text for literal translation from the original Hebrew and nonbold text for explanatory notes that otherwise would require a zillion square brackets:
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link
More options
Context Copy link