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Dating apps, on and off (because they are psychologically corrosive).
Dance classes (going to one tonight, actually), referrals from friends, bars (of various types), hosted gatherings at my house, gone to speed dating events, gone to car meets, church, social media, the gym. I'm currently pursuing a random DM I got from an (apparently) real woman on twitter that I already know isn't going to work out.
I am able to get dates. But the quality of woman I find is generally lacking, and they will ghost you without any warning even if you're 3 or so dates in. The norms around appropriate behavior are in shambles. Because women will accept zero correction of their behavior.
It is very expensive to keep paying for all these whilst seeing such poor results.
I've done everything except a Matchmaker or going abroad/mail order bride, basically. And I actually DID do a consult with an AI matchmaking startup, Keeper.AI and one of the founders himself told me "check back in 3-6 months" because they had no truly viable matches (as per their system) out of the 1.25 million women in their database.
The nearest/best one was a bit overweight for me, I was told. Ozempic to the rescue?
I wouldn't mail order but I would go abroad if you're in the anglosphere. Dating culture differs significantly within a country and between countries. In one place I dated for 2 years and never got stood up, in another place I got stood up frequently, in another I actually found a wife.
My top advice is just selection effects and heredity over everything. Men need to sample from as many places as possible through pure online dating but other than that you especially need to sample from wherever has the women the most like you politically and intellectually.
It still took me probably over a year and that's not counting the time I spent not using this strategy (that would make it several years), so 4 is not really out of the ordinary. Hopefully you will find something soon. The reality is that the system is messed up because it's all too costly and annoying in time and money even when it works out. What age bracket are you dating by the way? Marriage rates are down but young marriage is especially down so if you are dating under 25 it's clearly a systemic issue.
I sort of reject this solution because it exports the problem to that country. where are THEIR males supposed to go?
I mean, if I take a trip for other reasons and happen to find a wife, whatever.
Yes, and the political gap between young men and women is the largest its ever been. The women have flown off into la la land and nobody is correcting this trajectory.
Hence, the pool is too small.
I have no reason to think I will.
However, that is also not a reason to quit.
But understand that I AM OTHERWISE WELL SITUATED. I own a house. I make six figures in a decently high-status job. I am extremely physically fit. I am a martial arts instructor (i.e. I can physically dominate 90% of the male population), I am well liked, I can repair stuff, I'm not bad looking. And I'm six foot two.
There is zero reason I should be struggling.
And if I'm struggling, I can only imagine how bad it is for guys not so well situated. And I think its best to help out their plight too.
Basically anything above 21 and still in decent child-bearing shape. If I got my pick I'd aim for 25-27 (I'm most comfortable dealing with women in that bracket) but I have DIRECT EVIDENCE that I can pull 24-year-olds too.
But as to the filtering issue, finding a woman who is GENUINELY serious about getting married and is marriageable is the big one. There's no pressure on women to actually get married, and serious pressure on her to delay until she has her fun/her career is established. I don't think any individual guy can defeat this social pressure without a lot of assistance.
I remember reading your post a while back describing your struggles with dating, and now reading these posts as well it strikes me that maybe you're missing something important about how good of a partner you are. Like, you're checking all the objective boxes you think you need to check: stable, moderate/high status, attractive, tall, can fight other men, etc. You can get dates but they never seem to progress into something stable.
You remind me of a good friend of mine who's been fighting the dating market for years. He's similar: conservative, financially stable, owns two houses, good job, hobbies, relatively attractive, smart, charming, funny, etc. And I've watched him battle and battle and blame all the women. Meanwhile, me, the dorky friend got divorced and tried the dating apps for the first time (they suck), went on dates with two women and ended up marrying one and having a kid. So what's the difference? Well, the interesting thing is that my wife actually went on two dates with my friend years before we met. She said that at first he was great - fun to talk to, smart, charming. But by the end of the second date she new it would go nowhere. He was always 'on', always projecting some image. He's the equivalent of a high maintenance woman; very high standards, fussy, complains about shit all the time, feels like he is smarter and more cultured than everyone else. Me? I'm low maintenance. I find lots of body types attractive, I can flex and adjust around lots of quirks, I'm just easy to get along with. The most important thing for me was finding someone that had the same life goals, was compassionate and caring, and financially reasonable.
But there's good news! He finally did find woman that he lives with now and is planning to marry and have kids. She's South East Asian. Submissive. She wants the man who makes decisions and tells her what to do. She's lovely and I'm really happy for him.
That's a vague and silly reason to «know» it won't work out. It's date 2 and she dumped him for putting effort into his comportment? Seriously? If he hadn't she'd have dumped him for having too poor of manners on date 2.
That shouldn't be a problem if she's also on that level. Maybe the IQ gap was too big, which is a normal deal breaker.
For girls, giving reason for breakups is a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation. If the reason is good and actionable, the guy may take it as advice and think he has a chance if he betters himself. So now he keeps pursuing her. If the reason is vague, then she is being stupid and superficial. And if she gives no reason at all, then she is being a bitch who doesn't even care.
If the reason is good and actionable, and the man actions it, then they get back together and live happily ever after.
If the reason is good and unactionable, then they separate cleanly and no drama ensues.
The only way it turns out badly is if the reason is bad (for example, the reason given is not the true reason). The implication of your reasoning is that all reasons women give are bad, in which case we should recognize that as a society and judge women as a group accordingly.
(For the record, I think a big enough subset of women are capable of giving good reasons that we shouldn't do stuff like repeal the 19th amendment, but that's not the implication of your post.)
If a woman is uninterested in a man, she wants him to stop pursuing her. My implication is that any unactionable reason risks being perceived as bad or superficial because it is unactionable. It feels unfair to be rejected for reasons outside your control.
Meanwhile, a reason that is actionable risks causing the man to keep pursuing her. The opposite of what she wants.
What I am trying to say is that we should give women some slack on the reasons they provide for rejecting others. They are not necessarily aware of what actually causes them to be attracted and what the man could do anyway.
Yes, and women are currently being perceived as good and non-superficial above and beyond their ability to be good and non-superficial. Correcting this perception is good and desirable. We should, as a society, seek to perceive people as they are.
Women today benefit from a perception that they are wiser and that their desires and preferences reflect moral truth. Giving a true, unactionable reason damages this perception, which is why most do not want to do it. However, if we made it common knowledge that this is not the case, individual women would not need to give false reasons because they would already be correctly perceived as bad and non-superficial (or more accurately, less good and less superficial than they are currently perceived to be). The way to make this knowledge common is to hold women to strict standards when they say falsely represent their desires and correct them on it publicly.
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