site banner

Culture War Roundup for the week of March 6, 2023

This weekly roundup thread is intended for all culture war posts. 'Culture war' is vaguely defined, but it basically means controversial issues that fall along set tribal lines. Arguments over culture war issues generate a lot of heat and little light, and few deeply entrenched people ever change their minds. This thread is for voicing opinions and analyzing the state of the discussion while trying to optimize for light over heat.

Optimistically, we think that engaging with people you disagree with is worth your time, and so is being nice! Pessimistically, there are many dynamics that can lead discussions on Culture War topics to become unproductive. There's a human tendency to divide along tribal lines, praising your ingroup and vilifying your outgroup - and if you think you find it easy to criticize your ingroup, then it may be that your outgroup is not who you think it is. Extremists with opposing positions can feed off each other, highlighting each other's worst points to justify their own angry rhetoric, which becomes in turn a new example of bad behavior for the other side to highlight.

We would like to avoid these negative dynamics. Accordingly, we ask that you do not use this thread for waging the Culture War. Examples of waging the Culture War:

  • Shaming.

  • Attempting to 'build consensus' or enforce ideological conformity.

  • Making sweeping generalizations to vilify a group you dislike.

  • Recruiting for a cause.

  • Posting links that could be summarized as 'Boo outgroup!' Basically, if your content is 'Can you believe what Those People did this week?' then you should either refrain from posting, or do some very patient work to contextualize and/or steel-man the relevant viewpoint.

In general, you should argue to understand, not to win. This thread is not territory to be claimed by one group or another; indeed, the aim is to have many different viewpoints represented here. Thus, we also ask that you follow some guidelines:

  • Speak plainly. Avoid sarcasm and mockery. When disagreeing with someone, state your objections explicitly.

  • Be as precise and charitable as you can. Don't paraphrase unflatteringly.

  • Don't imply that someone said something they did not say, even if you think it follows from what they said.

  • Write like everyone is reading and you want them to be included in the discussion.

On an ad hoc basis, the mods will try to compile a list of the best posts/comments from the previous week, posted in Quality Contribution threads and archived at /r/TheThread. You may nominate a comment for this list by clicking on 'report' at the bottom of the post and typing 'Actually a quality contribution' as the report reason.

16
Jump in the discussion.

No email address required.

It seems to me a lot of the issues the US is going through stem from the fact the US hasn't had a proper crisis since the Great Depression. A good crisis that wipes the slate clean by destroying existing debts and wealth would fix a lot of things:

  • property prices and the appreciation assumption

  • student loans

  • intergenerational wealth gaps

  • social security spending

All of these things can be fixed if the stock market takes a nosedive and the dollar loses 90% of its value. In addition, it will make American exports extremely competitive, so the recovery should be relatively quick; also, this will hurt the PRC more than it hurts the US.

  • -12

My parents both didn't have money and didn't have sense to save/invest much. Despite this they've earned a life wage from the asset inflation alone by merely living in Stockholm and not renting during my lifetime.

Looking at the future it doesn't really seem to matter all that much how much me and my wife earn because that is going to be dwarfed by our real estate inheritences. We're in some kind of weird permanent middle class now whose life circumstances aren't really affected by income and employment.

I look at some of my friends that come from the countryside (or from abroad) and it's pretty grim, except for the spectacularly succuesful. This is made even worse by the compressed salary pyramid in Sweden, making catching up by wage labour practically impossible.

Are things looking to be better going forward? Of course not, it looks like it's getting worse. Skyrocketing interest rates crush the highly indebted but barely affects me, so I can invest more. It also halts almost all construction while at the same time the housing crisis gets worse.

We're in some kind of weird permanent middle class now whose life circumstances aren't really affected by income and employment.

Yeah. It's insane how common this trend is, where having somebody who decided to buy a decent property sometime in the last 50 years essentially guarantees a certain baseline of salubrity.

Even more insane in Australia where the house you live in isn't factored into your means-testing for the pension, which results in myriad cases of pensioners running their cash balances to 0 and then living on beans in a several million dollar house they bought for pennies 50 years ago solely for the sake of being able to pass said house onto their children when they die.